Water Well Fishing

water well fishing

PostBy: top top On: Tue Jan 31, 2017 8:05 pm

Looking for ideas, long story short submersible pump is stuck 40 feet down in four inch steel casing. The electric wire and one inch poly pipe released at the pump. The pipe clamp came up with the pipe, indicating the pipe did not break, it just pulled off. The 3/8 inch poly rope broke, not sure how much is still in the well. Then they tried to drop a steel bar on top of the pump to drive it down. The steel bar tangled into the pump rope, the new rope on the bar broke, so now it is also in the casing. Thinking of welding something like a lag bolt to a steel pipe and try to thread it into the fitting on the pump. If that works and we can pull on the pump again, then drop some hydrochloric acid into the well to dissolve the rust and free the pump. I never did this before, so I'm just sort of winging it here. I think he really needs to remove the bar first, as it may be obstructing the outlet fitting on the pump, precluding threading anything into it. Also thought about welding something like "star" shaped steel disc to the pipe and spin it until it wraps up the rope and we could pull it that way. Any input appreciated. He really can't afford a new well, but they need water. I have 330 gallon tank and a demand pump, I was thinking of putting it on a trailer and connecting it to the house. They couldn't drink it, but at least they could take showers, do laundry, etc.
Last edited by top top on Wed Feb 01, 2017 9:00 am, edited 1 time in total.
top top
 
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Re: water well fishing

PostBy: pyma On: Tue Jan 31, 2017 8:22 pm

Possibly a very strong magnet?? I understand the casing might present problems but if it could be put inside pvc pipe or the likes to get to the bar then retrieve it.
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Re: water well fishing

PostBy: urdahere On: Tue Jan 31, 2017 8:36 pm

urdahere
 
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Re: water well fishing

PostBy: top top On: Tue Jan 31, 2017 8:49 pm

Thanks for your reply. The problem is the bar would still be tangled with the 3/8 inch pump rope. I doubt any magnet would be stronger than that. I looked at professional well fishing magnets. A 3 1/2 inch magnet designed not to stick to the well casing is rated at 150 lbs. However that rating requires good contact with a flat surface. Something like a round steel bar with a point on top would offer far less contact. I did think about building a hook and try to snag the bar (the bar is tapered, with the big end up) and lift it as far as possible. Then weld cutters to a steel pipe (like line cutters for inboard boat shafts), drop that below the bar and spin it to chop up the rope. BTW, the bar is a digging iron, with the flat tamping end down, the weighted and pointed digging end up.

Thanks for that link, I'll spend some time looking it over.
Last edited by top top on Wed Feb 01, 2017 9:01 am, edited 1 time in total.
top top
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Alaska
Stove/Furnace Model: Kodiac Hand Fired with hopper.

Re: water well fishing

PostBy: warminmn On: Tue Jan 31, 2017 9:31 pm

For whatever its worth, if the old pump is not completely blocking your casing and you can still get a new pump deep enough to pump water, you can leave the old pump in there. I forget what year, but submersible pumps made after a certain year long ago are non-toxic. Older ones had some bad stuff in them.

But Im thinking you have the pump up out of the water? If you can still get a pipe along side of it you could put an above ground pump in. It would allow the well to still be used.

I am going to advise against putting any chemical into the well other than chlorine for disinfecting.

Ive been there, its no fun getting them out. Dont stick anything down in there that you don't want to drink later, or have fall in.

They sell household gravity water filters that will filter out anything you could imagine. I use one myself.
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Re: water well fishing

PostBy: waldo lemieux On: Tue Jan 31, 2017 9:43 pm

If you want to get a look down there , wait for a sunny day and get a handheld mirror and reflect the sunbeam down the hole. I the pump or bar is above water.......
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Re: water well fishing

PostBy: top top On: Tue Jan 31, 2017 10:03 pm

The pump has about eight feet of water over it. The bar is 4 to 5 feet long. Will try to get more accurate measurements. Was thinking of getting a bore scope that connects to a laptop computer. Have not yet looked for one with 40 feet of cable. I also just found out that the poly rope attached to the bar actually broke near the top end about a foot from the come-a-long, which means if we can snag it near the end it will reach out of the well. That would give us something to pull on the bar again. Since poly rope floats, it should be on top. Maybe use one of my tuna rods that is rigged with 80 lb test line and a treble hook.

The pump fills the casing, no room to drop anything past it. They tried to drive it down to the bottom and install a new pump above it, which is how the bar got in there. After getting the info on file at the health department, that won't work. The inlet screen would be blocked by the old pump and very little water would reach the new pump. I know what you're saying about chemicals, but the acid is SOP for this. One well driller said he could have gotten it out with acid if the water line or poly rope were still attached. I think they pump the well out and then dump in a base like soda to neutralize the acid.
Last edited by top top on Wed Feb 01, 2017 9:03 am, edited 1 time in total.
top top
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Alaska
Stove/Furnace Model: Kodiac Hand Fired with hopper.

Re: water well fishing

PostBy: warminmn On: Tue Jan 31, 2017 11:12 pm

Wow, you are really between a rock and a hard place. If it fills the whole casing you sure don't want it in there and it has to come out.

After you get it out I would try to find a smaller diameter pump to replace it with so it doesnt happen again next time. It must be wedged where two sections of casing met each other a little bit off.
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Re: water well fishing

PostBy: top top On: Tue Jan 31, 2017 11:24 pm

" It must be wedged where two sections of casing met each other a little bit off."

Could be, but everything I have seen blames rust. Apparently there is 1/4 inch difference between pump and casing, 1/8 inch clearance all round. He had already bought a new pump, but is going to return it for a slimline pump that "they" say will never get stuck. If he ends up buying a new well it will have plastic casing, so no rust.
top top
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Alaska
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Re: water well fishing

PostBy: pintoplumber On: Wed Feb 01, 2017 12:12 am

I've had 2 that were stuck over the years, but they weren't 4" pumps in a 4" well. That complicates things. I've welded a piece of channel iron to a 1/2" coupling and welded a couple of heavy nails sticking out as spikes. Drop 21' lengths of 1/2" black iron pipe down with the coupling arrangement and keep rotating clockwise. When you've wrapped around something and it's good and tight, pull up on the pipe. At this point we have a tripod and a come a long above the well. Dennis
Last edited by pintoplumber on Wed Feb 01, 2017 12:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: water well fishing

PostBy: Rob R. On: Wed Feb 01, 2017 6:53 am

I do not know of any tricks beyond what you have already mentioned.

Have you talked to one of your local well guys? Some of them likely know some tricks the rest of us do not. I even wonder if a drilling rig could "drill out" the pump.
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Re: water well fishing

PostBy: top top On: Wed Feb 01, 2017 7:39 am

He has spoke with three drillers, two just flat out said it's a lost hole and he needs a new well. That being based upon the water pipe and rope being lost. If he can snag the rope or the pump and it can be pulled again, the one said he could get it out using acid. One guy said he couldn't get out there to drill for at least six weeks, the other could start right away but his price is a LOT more. Probably explains why one is busy, the other isn't. The third guy said he could probably get the pump out and is willing to try for $250/hour, results not guaranteed. He was going to let him try, the guy was supposed to show up yesterday or call and be there this morning. Of course he never called nor showed.

They all say drilling through a pump is not an option. I know the oil well drillers have "junk" bits designed to drill through junk lost down the hole, but the water well guys don't do that. Of course oil & gas wells are deeper and more expensive, therefore worth the effort to salvage. I have thought of welding a cutting bit to a 40 ft pipe and hook it to my pto driven post hole digger. The digger has enough vertical travel to get all the way through the pump in one shot. Of course my luck it will just bind up and snap the pipe, leaving more junk in there. Or just set on top of the impeller shaft and spin it instead of drilling through it.
Last edited by top top on Wed Feb 01, 2017 9:15 am, edited 1 time in total.
top top
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Alaska
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Re: water well fishing

PostBy: titleist1 On: Wed Feb 01, 2017 8:12 am

I had the same thing happen quite a few years ago when trying to replace a pump in 30 year old rusted well casing. Unfortunately I don't have a good suggestion for you, nothing we tried worked and we ended up having to drill a new well.
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Re: water well fishing

PostBy: CapeCoaler On: Wed Feb 01, 2017 12:28 pm

Drop lite no shield with 100 watt led bulb...
That will get the lite down to the lower area...
usb scope type camera...
https://www.amazon.com/ZHOL-Waterproof-Pipeline-Inspection-Camera/dp/B004ADETZ0
then you can see what is going on rather than guessing... :!:
better than $250 hr... ;)
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Re: water well fishing

PostBy: tsb On: Wed Feb 01, 2017 2:00 pm

Google impact well drilling. Find one in your area.
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