Why us and not them ?

Why us and not them ?

PostBy: Sunny Boy On: Sat Mar 18, 2017 7:48 pm

Humm,... those openly, love-everybody Canadians detain illegals from Mexico and no one in the LSM says boo. But, if we do the same thing here in the USA,.... then they make it sound like we are evil. :mad:

https://www.yahoo.com/news/canadians-de ... 11128.html

Strange how the words "undocumented" and "illegal" can take on so different meanings, depending on who is on what side of what boarder,.... :cry:

Paul
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Re: Why us and not them ?

PostBy: rberq On: Sat Mar 18, 2017 9:42 pm

Sunny Boy wrote:Humm,... those openly, love-everybody Canadians detain illegals from Mexico and no one in the LSM says boo. But, if we do the same thing here in the USA,.... then they make it sound like we are evil.

If you stick to NEWS from the MSM, as opposed to OPINIONS, the media is just telling us what is going on. If you don't like their OPINIONS, they are almost always labelled as such, so don't read them. After all, you have opinions too, even FOX :o has opinions, don't demand that nobody else have them.

The Obama administration deported a record number of illegals. Trump administration is doing the same thing. Nobody much said boo in either case. Obama was targeting lawbreakers first, Trump targeting more or less whomever they find. Lots of folks from both parties have been in favor or revising the laws and providing a path for citizenship, and Trump while campaigning supported that idea to some extent. But it has not all come together and the laws haven't changed.
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Re: Why us and not them ?

PostBy: waldo lemieux On: Sun Mar 19, 2017 8:25 am

Sunny Boy wrote:Humm,... those openly, love-everybody Canadians


you obviously dont play hockey.... :D
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Re: Why us and not them ?

PostBy: Sunny Boy On: Sun Mar 19, 2017 9:38 am

I realize that a lot of libs don't like facts and would rather just go on "feelings",..... so, your telling me that If a news story lists data such as this, it's somehow just an opinion, huh ?

"Canada's border authorities detained more Mexicans in the first 67 days of 2017 than they did annually in any of the three previous years, according to statistics obtained by Reuters. ........................ "


"................... The Canada Border Services Agency (CBSA) said it detained 444 Mexican nationals between Jan. 1 and March 8, compared with 410 for all of 2016, 351 for 2015, and 399 for 2014. ........................"


And Reuters is not a news agency, but an opinion agency ?

And all those news stories showing pictures of demonstrations/protests in the US against deporting illegals are also just a reporter's opinions ? :roll:

Paul
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Re: Why us and not them ?

PostBy: Sunny Boy On: Sun Mar 19, 2017 9:41 am

waldo lemieux wrote:
Sunny Boy wrote:Humm,... those openly, love-everybody Canadians


you obviously dont play hockey.... :D


Nope. But, I do have friends from Canada and they never have waved sticks at me,.... so my view of Canadians might be a bit biased. :D

Paul
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Re: Why us and not them ?

PostBy: Pacowy On: Sun Mar 19, 2017 11:38 am

Yet again you rush to politicize everything, apparently without reading the document you cite. As described, Canada, on purpose, made it easier for Mexicans to enter by removing its visa requirement, effective December 2016. "Many Mexicans looking north have shifted their focus from the United States to Canada as President Donald Trump vows to crack down on America's undocumented immigrants, about half of whom are Mexican...With the visa requirement lifted, all that Mexicans need to come to Canada is an Electronic Travel Authorization (eTA), obtainable online in a matter of minutes...Canada issued 72,450 travel authorizations to Mexican citizens between Dec. 1, 2016, and March 10, 2017—a significant increase compared with a similar period when visas were required." So sure they detained more, because they let significantly more in. The number detained was about 0.6% of the number of travel authorizations, so even with the relaxed documentation requirements, the overwhelming majority had an identity that was clear enough that they were deemed to pose no danger to the public. Almost like Ivory soap, 99.44% pure.

So the story here is the opposite of what you have said. Canada is opening its doors to welcome more Mexican immigrants, and in the process is catching a small percentage of questionable ones, as it always has. Of the large numbers of honest and hard-working ones who enter without incident, no doubt many will seek work permits and eventual integration into Canadian society (ok, that might be an oxymoron, but you get the idea). And Canada will have eaten our lunch by stealing a page from our centuries-old playbook, building its future economy in part on the efforts of solid citizens, who otherwise would have come to the U.S.

If you really want to politicize it, I would say that all of this has happened because our new president chose to demonize Mexicans in general rather than find ways to improve on the existing robust U.S. efforts to deport Mexican immigrants who commit criminal acts (300,000+ deported annually under Obama for this) without alienating the solid citizens. But apparently he could sell it to you, so maybe at some point you should ask yourself whether this guy is really a businessman, or a salesman? There's a difference, and if you look you can see it in the rubble of your failed attempt to politicize this story.

Mike
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Re: Why us and not them ?

PostBy: Sunny Boy On: Sun Mar 19, 2017 12:58 pm

Once again, Mike, you make a long-winded post about assumptions of what I meant.

Political ? Duh yeah! Of course it's political,.... and national,.... and international,..... and it can also be personal. It can be a lot of things to a lot of people.

And of course I read the article. However, assuming otherwise and missing the point, shows that it's not me that has a lack of reading skill.

And I would say it's not Trump and that's a poor excuse. You know very well that this has been going on long before he ever announced running for President.

MY POINT is,... when the USA deports "undocumented people", they are not portrayed as "Illegals" or law breakers by many on the left (who by doing so make it political-see the connection ?). Hence the word "undocumented" so often used by the left and the left-leaning media. When the USA is doing the EXACT SAME THING, as Canada did, it is viewed as a bad thing and rarely by those on the right (again making it political). You may have noticed that those of us on the right still prefer to call them "Illegal aliens". But, when Canada does the exact same thing THE US does, they are simply portrayed as just deporting people who are "Illegal aliens" and should not be in their country.

So if you don't like that it's political, then take your complaint to your leftist friends and media who don't want to call it what it is.

And, if you stop trying to muddy the waters in an attempt to change the direction of the post just to refute it,.... you might actually get the point of my post. After all, it really is simple - USA deports illegals = bad. Canada deports illegals = who cares ?

Or, maybe that's all too simple a concept. :roll:

Paul
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Re: Why us and not them ?

PostBy: coalnewbie On: Sun Mar 19, 2017 1:28 pm

It's always long winded and misses the point. What is to the point is this ....

http://dailycaller.com/2017/03/18/30-co ... us-crimes/

Stupid is as stupid does.
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Re: Why us and not them ?

PostBy: scalabro On: Sun Mar 19, 2017 2:45 pm

Paul,

It pains me to see you continually volley back and forth with liberals who "care" more than you.

Stop casting pearls before swine.

Remember they have a mental disorder.

:lol:
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Re: Why us and not them ?

PostBy: Pacowy On: Sun Mar 19, 2017 3:16 pm

Sunny Boy wrote:Once again, Mike, you make a long-winded post about assumptions of what I meant.

Political ? Duh yeah! Of course it's political,.... and national,.... and international,..... and it can also be personal. It can be a lot of things to a lot of people.

And of course I read the article. However, assuming otherwise and missing the point, shows that it's not me that has a lack of reading skill.

And I would say it's not Trump and that's a poor excuse. You know very well that this has been going on long before he ever announced running for President.

MY POINT is,... when the USA deports "undocumented people", they are not portrayed as "Illegals" or law breakers by many on the left (who by doing so make it political-see the connection ?). Hence the word "undocumented" so often used by the left and the left-leaning media. When the USA is doing the EXACT SAME THING, as Canada did, it is viewed as a bad thing and rarely by those on the right (again making it political). You may have noticed that those of us on the right still prefer to call them "Illegal aliens". But, when Canada does the exact same thing THE US does, they are simply portrayed as just deporting people who are "Illegal aliens" and should not be in their country.

So if you don't like that it's political, then take your complaint to your leftist friends and media who don't want to call it what it is.

And, if you stop trying to muddy the waters in an attempt to change the direction of the post just to refute it,.... you might actually get the point of my post. After all, it really is simple - USA deports illegals = bad. Canada deports illegals = who cares ?

Or, maybe that's all too simple a concept. :roll:

Paul


Thanks for the clarification on the limits of what you were trying to say, but your cite still doesn't support them. The story says Canada is detaining - not deporting - a miniscule percentage of the Mexicans who are taking advantage of an "open door" policy Canada has just implemented. Under the policy people can be detained "if it is believed they pose a danger to the public, if their identity is unclear or if they are deemed unlikely to appear for removal or for a proceeding." Maybe some of them wind up being deported if they are found to be actual "bad guys". Nowhere have I seen any place where anybody of any political persuasion has argued against excluding immigration to the U.S. by known bad actors who pose a danger to the public, people whose identity is unclear, etc. AFAIK Obama's admin continued and expanded a W initiative to increase use of formal processing and record-keeping at border crossings, and increased physical barriers and surveillance to achieve the same goal. So Canada is doing the same things we've been trying to do to exclude the actual "bad guys", while proving an easy path for anybody who isn't a bad guy to become documented and basically welcomed.

Your attempt to equate that to the stuff Trump - yes, Trump - has proposed and pursued is pure fantasy. Where Canada is letting in basically anybody who isn't known or reasonably believed to be a bad guy, you are advocating the potential removal of people who are already here purely on the basis of the status of their immigration paperwork. Since the U.S. already has an aggressive program that deports undocumented immigrants who commit criminal acts while here, you're talking about new deportations of people who otherwise are law-abiding citizens. Guess what? Basically every one of them would qualify for a Canadian eTA as soon as they touch down. So the Canadian plan that you attempt to rely on would basically welcome to Canada all of the new deportees the Trump efforts would create. Not sure what they put in your Kool-Aid for you to believe the Trump stuff is "the EXACT SAME THING" as Canada has done. It isn't.

Mike
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Re: Why us and not them ?

PostBy: Pacowy On: Sun Mar 19, 2017 3:35 pm

coalnewbie wrote:It's always long winded and misses the point. What is to the point is this ....

http://dailycaller.com/2017/03/18/30-co ... us-crimes/

Stupid is as stupid does.


I agree if that is happening we should do more about it. It might help to know a little more about who the 30 are.

Mike
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Re: Why us and not them ?

PostBy: Pacowy On: Mon Mar 20, 2017 12:00 am

scalabro wrote:Paul,

It pains me to see you continually volley back and forth with liberals who "care" more than you.

Stop casting pearls before swine.

Remember they have a mental disorder.

:lol:


I didn't notice anyone claiming to "care" more than anyone else. Members on both sides have put effort into explaining/clarifying their views.

Interesting that you refer to "pearls before swine". I believe the whole quote is "Do not...cast your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn and tear you in pieces." If you believe Paul is doing a good job, why do you want him to stop? If you believe he is being torn to pieces, why don't you help? Only the purveyor of fake pearls is threatened by efforts to test their authenticity.

If you wish to sit in judgment of swine, I suggest you try the Big E.

Mike
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Re: Why us and not them ?

PostBy: waldo lemieux On: Mon Mar 20, 2017 7:34 am

Nicely put Mike, though Im certain they'll never get it...
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Re: Why us and not them ?

PostBy: Pacowy On: Mon Mar 20, 2017 7:49 am

Thanks. As my high school French teacher used to say in describing situations with long odds - "on peut toujours esperer" (one can always hope...).

Mike
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Re: Why us and not them ?

PostBy: samhill On: Mon Mar 20, 2017 8:51 am

Oddly enough there doesn't seem to be a bigly amount of crimes committed by those rascally rascals here illegally.
https://qz.com/895624/how-much-crime-is ... mmigrants/
I tend to think that the despair & fear form of governing has a lot to do with our hatred of those different from some. I tend to believe that those in power tend to use division as a tool for a smokescreen to cover their own illegal doings & fears.
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