More EFM questions....

More EFM questions....

PostBy: CoalJockey On: Wed Sep 24, 2008 8:04 pm

Well I tried to think of everything..... :(

I am putting a 520 Boiler in a 12 X 14 shed. I planned and planned and layed awake hours at a time in bed planning. Now I Have the boiler, and barrel set up and ready to go for plumbing..... then it hits me like a brick. It is not recommended that the furnace be set on a combustible floor..... Im guessing for fire safety reasons? And I have it set up on 3/4 inch Advantek wooden flooring with reinforcements underneath.

Well to get that sucker where it is I had to set the furnace up on the floor with a skid steer loader and built the building around it, because I knew the boiler would be too heavy to move in by hand.

I wanted to see what you folks think.... I figure I have too choices.... say the heck with it and leave it how it is or get a piece of plate steel under it somehow. I am leaning toward the second choice, as I would like to do it right. What do you guys think?

My only option to get a plate under there is to come in with an engine hoist and pick up the boiler off the base, slide the base out, place my steel, and then set the furnace back together on the plate.... which I guess isnt a real big deal.

How heavy of a plate should I use??? Would quarter inch be enough??

Thanks for any thoughts on this
CoalJockey
 
Stove/Furnace Make: EFM
Stove/Furnace Model: 1300 & 520

Re: More EFM questions....

PostBy: billw On: Wed Sep 24, 2008 8:11 pm

By the term engine hoist do you mean a shop crane? I used one to set my 520. The problem was the crane's legs were to close together to get around the base. I had to set the base on cinder blocks to get the boiler section mounted. Make sure you have enough clearance to do what you intend. As far as the steel thickness I'll let an expert address that. I would only be guessing.
billw
 
Stove/Furnace Make: EFM 520
Stove/Furnace Model: GOODBYE OIL COMPANY

Re: More EFM questions....

PostBy: Mark (PA) On: Wed Sep 24, 2008 8:47 pm

Hi Tyler

When I set mine on my base i rented the Engine hoist from True Value in Bedford. $18... well spent. Nice thing about that one was the legs were wide enough to go on either side...

That said.. my "opinion" on the flooring. I would put some plate in the front and side of the stoker but I don't know that i'd worry about putting it directly under it. Did you put it up on any block or anything? I don't know this is a tough one! if it is up on blocks maybe cut some plate to fit in under there and around the sides. if not on blocks... you might be better off lifting it up and putting some plate under it. I don't think the thickness really matters as long as the wooden floor undernearth it is good. I bet you could go with 3/16 or so even. its not going to make much difference.

Good luck in your decision!
Mark (PA)
 
Stove/Furnace Make: 1953 EFM SF-520 High Boy
Stove/Furnace Model: Fitzgibbon Boiler

Re: More EFM questions....

PostBy: CoalJockey On: Wed Sep 24, 2008 8:55 pm

Thanks Bill and Mark....

I was sitting here thinking of this some more. I think your right.... I could get away with a thinner metal. I may go ahead and get a sheet cut to go under the whole boiler and barrel...... the floor is good and strong, but this would help reinforce the whole thing.

I think that hoist we have at the shop should work. I think the legs will go wide enough.... I will measure tomorrow for sure. The more I think of it it shouldnt be as hard as I thought. Just simply pick up the boiler, slide the base out, get my plate fastened down and set things back up. ;)

Thanks alot fellas
Tyler Hall
CoalJockey
 
Stove/Furnace Make: EFM
Stove/Furnace Model: 1300 & 520

Re: More EFM questions....

PostBy: mozz On: Wed Sep 24, 2008 9:06 pm

I would guess that metal plate would conduct your heat too good. I would buy some block 12" square 1 1/2 or 2" thick and buy as many as needed, say 12 block or so. I would put a sheet of that cement backerboard on top of that, they are usually 3'x5', 1/4" or 1/2".
mozz
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Axeman Anderson 1982 AA-130 Steam

Re: More EFM questions....

PostBy: Freddy On: Wed Sep 24, 2008 11:36 pm

Stop the presses! A steel plate under the boiler will not help with the problem. It will transfer the heat and be just the same as no plate....unless your boiler has no bottom, then you'll need a steel plate and... cement blocks, 2" thick is fine. If you can find it they make 1" thick artificial slate, that'd work OK too. I haven't looked for years, but it used to come 4' by 4' or 4' by 8'. For added beauty & peace of mind, cut a wheel barrel full of 3/4" pieces of copper pipe, or iron, and put them every 6" on the floor, put the slate or blocks on them. The air space under the blocks will add greatly to keeping the floor cool.

A common jack and a red strap might pick up the boiler. Lift one end, add blocks, lift the other & repeat. Never put your fingers where they might get pinched. Certainly lifting it all at once would be easier.

What's the bottom of your boiler look like?
Freddy
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Axeman Anderson 130 (pea)
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: Reading piece o' junk in the barn (rice)
Coal Size/Type: Pea size, Superior, deep mined

Re: More EFM questions....

PostBy: CoalJockey On: Thu Sep 25, 2008 5:50 am

Freddy....

You think a plate may conduct the heat just the same..... Hmmmm

Its a 520 EFM with the standard base under it pretty much. What about having the plate under it and then the small blocks under each corner to keep the air flowing under it?? Our 1300 sits right on the concrete and I never thought about the heat transfer.....

Back to thinking again.... :?

Thanks fellas
Tyler
CoalJockey
 
Stove/Furnace Make: EFM
Stove/Furnace Model: 1300 & 520

Re: More EFM questions....

PostBy: Mark (PA) On: Thu Sep 25, 2008 1:14 pm

I don't know what the heat transfer would be... its well to think of it I suppose but I really didn't think there would be THAT much heat in the base. and again i'm probably way off. Stokerman or Freddy can answer much better I suppose...

I was thinking last night you guys probably had a lift in your shop you could use... good deal!
Mark (PA)
 
Stove/Furnace Make: 1953 EFM SF-520 High Boy
Stove/Furnace Model: Fitzgibbon Boiler

Re: More EFM questions....

PostBy: franpipeman On: Thu Sep 25, 2008 4:34 pm

i put cermic tile on my plywood floor formy boiler room inexpenseive stuff and looks great. that is a fine fire barrier
franpipeman
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: efm 520 stoker fitzgibbons pressure vessel
Hand Fed Coal Stove: harman, russo
Coal Size/Type: rice

Re: More EFM questions....

PostBy: CoalJockey On: Thu Sep 25, 2008 6:22 pm

Well it is done.... I hope

This may have not been the best way but I think it will work well..... and I used what I had readily availible today... because possibly start plumbing this weekend.

Cut a 5 foot by 5 foot sheet of 1/16 inch steel. Then I used one inch square tubing and tacked that to the sheet to form two long rails running the long length of the boiler. Then I cut two more one inch square tubes and laid them across the ends (crossways) and welded them on top of the first two. This allowed the base to be supported at the front and the back and Thus lifting the base two inches off the floor and at the same time allowing air to flow freely under the whole thing.... as the boiler is still supported nicely across the entire floor. I didnt want it up on blocks because of the weight being only on the corners could possibly buckle the floor, even though it is supported underneath. Should be good and strong.

I know the sheet isnt the strongest.... but it gave me something to weld the tubing to, and keep it from moving..... and at the same time keep any hot ash off the wood (not likely but just in case). Lifted the boiler with the engine hoist.... moved base out, laid down sheet. Lined base up on top of rails.... and set the whole thing back down again.

Painted it all up to finish it off prior to setting it under and it doesnt look too bad ;)

Thanks for the thoughts..... much appriciated
Tyler Hall

EDIT: This morning I put my hand on the base of the 1300... and at 140 degrees in the boiler, the base is only mildly warm and about 8 inches below the boiler it is cold.... so I hope what I did will be well enough. :gee:
CoalJockey
 
Stove/Furnace Make: EFM
Stove/Furnace Model: 1300 & 520

Re: More EFM questions....

PostBy: stoker-man On: Thu Sep 25, 2008 6:31 pm

My wife's grandparents lived in a literal tar paper shack, built from pallet wood from Mack Truck. They heated the shack with about 5 pot belly stoves and never had anything on the floor around them. When the grandmother died in '82, he tended the stoves for another 6 years or so, but being in his nineties, he wasn't so careful anymore and had alot of burn marks on the floor around each stove. I think he did a good job considering that he was totally blind since 1930.
stoker-man
 
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: 1981 efm wcb-24 in use 365 days a year
Coal Size/Type: Anthracite/Chestnut
Other Heating: Hearthstone wood stove

Re: More EFM questions....

PostBy: Freddy On: Thu Sep 25, 2008 6:57 pm

You used one inch square tube to space it? Oh no! That's not enough! You should have used 1 1/32nd at least! HA! I'm yanking your chain.... What you've done will be just fine. Now the air can move any heat and it'll be fine for the first 200 years. Now.... get the wrenches & torch out!
Freddy
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Axeman Anderson 130 (pea)
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: Reading piece o' junk in the barn (rice)
Coal Size/Type: Pea size, Superior, deep mined

Re: More EFM questions....

PostBy: CoalJockey On: Thu Sep 25, 2008 9:14 pm

Thanks fellas

I guess we will be plumbing! :band: :dancing: :drunk:

Happy Day

Tyler
CoalJockey
 
Stove/Furnace Make: EFM
Stove/Furnace Model: 1300 & 520

Re: More EFM questions....

PostBy: e.alleg On: Thu Sep 25, 2008 11:00 pm

my grandma had her pot belly wood stove on the 150 year old wood floor. the chimney would clean itself once in a while. her house had to be bulldozed down when she passed away, it didn't burn. Guess it depends on how much you trust in things is what you can get away with...
e.alleg
 
Stove/Furnace Make: EFM
Stove/Furnace Model: 520

Re: More EFM questions....

PostBy: CoalJockey On: Fri Sep 26, 2008 6:57 am

E. Alleg.....

Ive actually delivered coal into places just like you and Stokerman just described. Man some of the places we go....

Used to put into the basement of a bar.... dirt floor.... junk piled all around.... had to move two week old bags of garbage just to get to the bin and dont even mention the rats.

But yea.... I remember a place when I was younger.... its gone now though. But just like you said one or two rooms with wooden floors and pot belly stoves.... Tar paper around the whole thing and lit by three or four lanterns hanging from the ceiling. Makes you appriciate what you have thats for sure.

Tyler
CoalJockey
 
Stove/Furnace Make: EFM
Stove/Furnace Model: 1300 & 520