I was asleep at the wheel. The reason I mentioned a bronze pump was because I thought you were heating domestic hot water. You'd mentioned a boiler mate & I had it in my head that's where the heat was going. The guys after me gave good and better info. The reason I mentioned a valve in line was to throttle a pump down to the flow rate you need.
Pex should not be used within 18" of any boiler, says so in the instructions. As with the others, pex for this application is questionable.
Help- Hw Coil Not Working, Have Pics
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- Member
- Posts: 35
- Joined: Thu. Jun. 05, 2008 1:12 am
- Location: cape cod
You definetly need a circulator. For thermo-siphon to work piping from the stove needs to be uphill. Your piping comes from the stove then goes down, you are getting no circulation at all, that is why the pex is bubling at the ends, the pipes are transferring the heat from the stove to the pex. I agree with every one else that the coil is not large enough to heat your boiler to keep it off. My suggestion would be pipe it directly to your indirect water heater teeing off the inlet through the coil and back into the PRV, and definetly a separate PRV at the outlet of the stove coil. Make sure piping for potable water is used.
- CoalHeat
- Member
- Posts: 8862
- Joined: Sat. Feb. 10, 2007 9:48 pm
- Location: Stillwater, New Jersey
- Stoker Coal Boiler: 1959 EFM 350
- Hand Fed Coal Stove: Harman Magnafire Mark I
- Baseburners & Antiques: Sears Signal Oak 15 & Andes Kitchen Range
- Coal Size/Type: Rice and Chestnut
- Other Heating: Fisher Fireplace Insert
You need a storage tank, a circulator pump (small) and a ball or gate valve to control the flow. Install a thermometer on the return line to the tank and use it to adjust the water flow. I have my gate valve 1/4 of a turn open, any more and the thermometer starts to drop.
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- Member
- Posts: 23
- Joined: Tue. Jan. 22, 2008 3:49 pm
- Location: Boylston, MA
So it's been a while, and I have an update. The Hilkoil HW coil in my Harman MkII is working great!
If you read through the thread, you'll see I have a "non-traditional" setup. Coil is piped through my Weil-McClain WGO boiler. Boiler feeds an Amtrol Boilermate indirect heater.
Many here thought this would never work as intended, and that the coil needed to be plumbed directly to a separate spare water heater tank as advised in the instructions, or to the boilermate directly with a series of shutoff valves to cut things over between boiler fire or coal fire.
Well, I'm happy to report that, having slapped a circulator on the loop, that it works nicely! The fire has to be hot and built up. But with that, I've seen the boiler temp gauge go from 70-80 degrees all the way up to 170 with just a slow circulation over several hours. It would never do that before. How do I know boiler burner didn't come on? I unplugged the lead to burner in the Honeywell front control. It's only been a few days experience with it, but I can already tell that if the coal fire is hot and built up, the circulator will pick up the heat and raise the boiler temp right up. Then the Amtrol works as it always did right off the boiler. No schlepping around for cheapo hot water heater and installing that, no auxiliary plumbing and shutoff valves- none of that mess.
I bought the Grundfos 3 speed circulator and then had my guy install it on the front. I'll get pictures.
Should help people with a similar setup with some ideas.
-Brian
If you read through the thread, you'll see I have a "non-traditional" setup. Coil is piped through my Weil-McClain WGO boiler. Boiler feeds an Amtrol Boilermate indirect heater.
Many here thought this would never work as intended, and that the coil needed to be plumbed directly to a separate spare water heater tank as advised in the instructions, or to the boilermate directly with a series of shutoff valves to cut things over between boiler fire or coal fire.
Well, I'm happy to report that, having slapped a circulator on the loop, that it works nicely! The fire has to be hot and built up. But with that, I've seen the boiler temp gauge go from 70-80 degrees all the way up to 170 with just a slow circulation over several hours. It would never do that before. How do I know boiler burner didn't come on? I unplugged the lead to burner in the Honeywell front control. It's only been a few days experience with it, but I can already tell that if the coal fire is hot and built up, the circulator will pick up the heat and raise the boiler temp right up. Then the Amtrol works as it always did right off the boiler. No schlepping around for cheapo hot water heater and installing that, no auxiliary plumbing and shutoff valves- none of that mess.
I bought the Grundfos 3 speed circulator and then had my guy install it on the front. I'll get pictures.
Should help people with a similar setup with some ideas.
-Brian
- SMITTY
- Member
- Posts: 12520
- Joined: Sun. Dec. 11, 2005 12:43 pm
- Location: West-Central Mass
- Stoker Coal Boiler: EFM 520 Highboy
- Coal Size/Type: Rice / Blaschak anthracite
- Other Heating: Oil fired Burnham boiler
I installed my coils the same way -- directly into the boiler. I have 2 coils -- the Hilkoil 21T.
Just one note to everyone -- even though he has the 18T, & it measures 18" long just as mine measures 21", you have to measure the entire length of the pipe. 18" up, 18" back, then about 3" or so for the "U", so in reality, it's a 39" coil, total length. Mine ends up being just over 6' each (if my memory serves me right ), for a total length of just under 13' .
Mine are heating 2 zones constantly & my Amtrol indirect-fired boiler too. My burner still kicks on, but only during high demand & just after loading with coal due to the radiant heat of the fire being covered up. It maintains about 155* - 163*. I lowered the hi & lo-limit temps on my boilers aquastat to minimize burner run time.
I'm using MUCH less oil than I would use without the coils. I've used 1/8th a tank in one month with the 2 zones set at 70*, where I would use that amount in 4 days with t-stats set at 65* pre-coal.
Here's some links to my install:
Hey Greg or Yanche: Water Coil Question for Ya (questions I had before buying coils)
The Project Has Begun: Harman Mark III Heating Coil Install (installing the coils)
First Fire in MARK III With New Coils - THEY WORK!! (first fire with coils & new stove)
Just one note to everyone -- even though he has the 18T, & it measures 18" long just as mine measures 21", you have to measure the entire length of the pipe. 18" up, 18" back, then about 3" or so for the "U", so in reality, it's a 39" coil, total length. Mine ends up being just over 6' each (if my memory serves me right ), for a total length of just under 13' .
Mine are heating 2 zones constantly & my Amtrol indirect-fired boiler too. My burner still kicks on, but only during high demand & just after loading with coal due to the radiant heat of the fire being covered up. It maintains about 155* - 163*. I lowered the hi & lo-limit temps on my boilers aquastat to minimize burner run time.
I'm using MUCH less oil than I would use without the coils. I've used 1/8th a tank in one month with the 2 zones set at 70*, where I would use that amount in 4 days with t-stats set at 65* pre-coal.
Here's some links to my install:
Hey Greg or Yanche: Water Coil Question for Ya (questions I had before buying coils)
The Project Has Begun: Harman Mark III Heating Coil Install (installing the coils)
First Fire in MARK III With New Coils - THEY WORK!! (first fire with coils & new stove)