Guilt by Association. Hang the Man!!

Guilt by Association. Hang the Man!!

PostBy: kootch88 On: Thu Oct 30, 2008 12:36 pm

I am sick and tired of reading about Obama being guilty because of his associations, so here is one I am curious about. There are numerous other examples, but this one is a really easy case to dissect.

Everyone knows Bush Sr. was the last to jump ship on Nixon and in fact waited 2 weeks before the resignation before finally withdrawing his support for the embattled President. We also know, regardless of his strengths and weaknesses, Nixon was a liar and a cheat, at the very least during his second term. His Plumbers ( No, Joe couldn't make it) did their thing, as we all know and Nixon then started his long list of lies on that particular subject. Though I thought Bush was a fairly ineffective President, I always thought of him as a good man who was trustworthy and ethical. By today’s standards, we really shouldn’t have trusted him, should we?

In my family I have an older brother who is a raging Boston left winger and a younger brother who is a right wing religious psycho living in Alabama. My younger brother even became a Southern Baptist!! Many of my friends are very conservative and a few are extremely liberal. So far my position has not changed by their influence. Why is it Obama is guilty for his associations? Should we only associate with people who we agree with? This site would be dead if that were true. Do we think because he associates with these people that he will suddenly be corrupt? It makes no sense what so ever to me, but I would like to hear why I should be worried.
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Re: Guilt by Association. Hang the Man!!

PostBy: Devil505 On: Thu Oct 30, 2008 12:50 pm

kootch88 wrote:We also know, regardless of his strengths and weaknesses, Nixon was a liar and a cheat, at the very least during his second term. His Plumbers ( No, Joe couldn't make it) did their thing, as we all know and Nixon then started his long list of lies on that particular subject.


I think this is at the heart of the American voter's disgust with the present day Republican Party. Nixon was the first Republican President who considered his political foes as ENEMIES, not just rivals, but actually Enemies of the State!
GW Bush & the Neo-Cons have have brought back that angry & hateful brand of Nixonian politics where just beating your political opponent is not good enough......You must DESTROY them!.
Guilt by association is just one arrow in the Karl Rove, "Swiftboater's" quiver that has brought our election campaigning down into the gutter, from which the (once honorable) John McCain likes to launch his angry, desperate & Un-American personal attacks &.......it's not working....Not this time!

BTW...Karl Rove was exactly who I had in mind when I posted this thread: Republicans- The Fat Kid On The Block

(I predict that John McCain may just barely win his state of Arizona on 11/4 but will lose his Senate seat the next time her runs)
Last edited by Devil505 on Thu Oct 30, 2008 1:00 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Guilt by Association. Hang the Man!!

PostBy: kootch88 On: Thu Oct 30, 2008 12:54 pm

I know it isn't working Dick, that is obvious, and it is also obvious others are sick of the campaign, but I want a reasonable explanation as to why I should be concerned with these associations. I can think of many, many examples of why it shouldn't matter, but none to the contrary.
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Re: Guilt by Association. Hang the Man!!

PostBy: Devil505 On: Thu Oct 30, 2008 12:57 pm

kootch88 wrote:but I want a reasonable explanation as to why I should be concerned with these associations. I can think of many, many examples of why it shouldn't matter, but none to the contrary.



That's like asking for a "reasonable explanation" of the acts of a crazy man..........No "reason" is involved......just lunacy & desperation.
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Re: Guilt by Association. Hang the Man!!

PostBy: mr1precision On: Thu Oct 30, 2008 1:10 pm

Let me give it a try. Lets just say someone hangs around with the Crips or Bloods. He seems like a nice guy but he hangs around with gang members. Would you be a little concerned if you new he was going to come over to your house for dinner?
Or would you say gee he seems real nice and it doesnt matter? BTW, I'm not saying that BO is a gangster either.
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Re: Guilt by Association. Hang the Man!!

PostBy: kootch88 On: Thu Oct 30, 2008 1:26 pm

Let me give it a try. Lets just say someone hangs around with the Crips or Bloods. He seems like a nice guy but he hangs around with gang members. Would you be a little concerned if you new he was going to come over to your house for dinner?
Or would you say gee he seems real nice and it doesnt matter? BTW, I'm not saying that BO is a gangster either.


I don't see that as holding water. First off, most people who are subject to the Cripps or blood are younger, much more impressionable and have not developed the capacity to segregate popularity and short term gain from long term a long term benefit. If Obama was 13 or so, the age gangs try to recruit kids at, I could see your point. I am not saying associations don't matter, I am saying you have to look at them critically rather than making assumptions all associations are good or bad. Same holds true for religion. Some people may be influenced by religion and some may not, no matter how much exposure they get.
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Re: Guilt by Association. Hang the Man!!

PostBy: bear creek burnout On: Thu Oct 30, 2008 1:35 pm

I will paraphrase this quote somewhat.....
"For those who understand, No explanation is necessary...For those who don't, No explanation is possible! ..."
If history has taught us anything about our politics it's that it always ends up in the gutter...driven there by both sides.
As far as BHO's associations....well if it were just one...or maybe two...I could understand. But.....let's see....one, two, three, four, five, six, ...probably more....
You guys figure it all out as to who they are....the names are like a Who's Who of radical leftist politicos....not that that's a bad thing...but it is true....by BHO's own admission. Bomb throwers all...either literally or figuratively.... It all just rolls off him....kind of like a teflon candidate. If he were not running for POTUS he wouldn't even get a low level clearance with his past associations lingering about him.
It has been said that he is both accomplished and courageous...yet I can't point to one accomplishment or one act of courage....can anyone? Not the platitudes or cliches that so many throw around about him....real accomplishments and courage.
If he's elected he will be our President....representing all of us not just liberals or democrats....all of us. So I will wish him the best because it is in my own interest that he succeed...if he's elected. But....I don't have to vote for him...!
Just my opinion....I could be wrong.... :secret:
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Re: Guilt by Association. Hang the Man!!

PostBy: kootch88 On: Thu Oct 30, 2008 1:40 pm

Please tell me about the other bomb thrower associations, I don't know about them. Maybe there is a pattern I am not aware of.
Last edited by kootch88 on Thu Oct 30, 2008 2:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Guilt by Association. Hang the Man!!

PostBy: av8r On: Thu Oct 30, 2008 1:41 pm

It may not matter to you. It obviously doesn't matter to quite a few folks. This apathetic condition is one of the big reasons I feel that this country has become such a load as compared to what it was 25-50 years ago. Nobody cares anymore. Everything is everyone else's problem. When a problem arises most folks start with whom to blame, even if that problem is one that they clearly own. We're more interested in the "Whos" than in the "Why's". I see it at work with some of the younger guys/gals and my wife, who is a teacher sees it everyday. Little Johnny is fooling around all day long in class...causing interruptions and taking instruction time away from the rest of the class. He misses the fact that there is a test. He doesn't show his parents his agenda from that day that explains there is a test. The parents don't ask what work he has either. They don't check the webpage I maintain for my wife that has all the homework and test schedules on it either. The test comes and he gets a 32. The next day my wife gets a scathing note demanding to know why Johnny wasn't given time to study, why wasn't he warned about this upcoming test and how this is no way to run a classroom. The parent demands that Johnny be given a makeup test as well. Don't laugh. This happens at least once a week and not just in my wife's classroom. When the parent has the situation explained to them, they very rarely, if ever, apologize. This will happen many more times this year with the same parents. They're not interested in the facts...they want to blame someone for the failure...anyone but the correct person.

No

One

Cares
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Re: Guilt by Association. Hang the Man!!

PostBy: bear creek burnout On: Thu Oct 30, 2008 1:54 pm

Please tell me aboutthe other bomb thrower associations, I don't know about them. Maybe there is a pattern I am not aware of.

You can easily check these out but here a more than a few....
As written in The National Review.....10/13/08:
"Re ACORN, Jeremiah Wright, Bill Ayers, Bernadine Dohrn, Frank Marshal Davis, Khalid Abdullah Tariq al-Mansour, Rashid Khalidi, Raila Odinga, and all of the assorted leftists and figures of ambiguous or veiled allegiance that form an unbroken chain throughout Obama's life, it is not a question of "palling around." It is a question of shared worldview. The only candidate who has surrounded himself with and befriended a freak show of racists, anti-Semites, and America haters is Barack Obama. This isn't guilt by association. These are Obama's life experiences. And you'd think it would be more problematic than a few people in an audience shouting out some nasty things about Obama."
You can tack on Rev Flagler, L. Farakhan.....on and on and on.....
Barry.....you got sum splainin to do......
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Re: Guilt by Association. Hang the Man!!

PostBy: kootch88 On: Thu Oct 30, 2008 2:31 pm

OK, thanks for the list. What about his associations with Buffett, General Petraeus, Colin Powell (oops, I forgot, he is now a bad guy) and I could go on and on with folks that are generally accepted as clean and positive Americans. Are they now corrupt because they consider Obama a friend and close associate? Do they give him bonus points or do those associations get discounted for some reason?

What about Bush and all the people who associated with the Plumbers, were they tarnished becuase they hung out with a bunch of folks who were anti constitution?
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Re: Guilt by Association. Hang the Man!!

PostBy: Devil505 On: Thu Oct 30, 2008 2:43 pm

mr1precision wrote:Let me give it a try. Lets just say someone hangs around with the Crips or Bloods. He seems like a nice guy but he hangs around with gang members. .



If the basic premise of your statement was true, it would be worthy of discussion.....It Isn't!

Obama no more "Hangs Around" with these people than you or I. Obama is not an enemy of the state, a terrorist, a criminal, a communist or anything else the sick minds of Karl Rove & the present day "Swiftboaters" are vomiting up at us. He is the Democratic candidate for President of the United States & the junior Senator from Illinois.....PERIOD.
These attacks do far more damage to the Republican Party than they do to Obama, which will make itself quite evident on 11/4 when the Republican Party, (very deservedly) will suffer its worst defeat in the history of this nation, & may never fully recover their former respectable standing in the eyes of the American people.

(funny thing is......I think you guys.....deep down....KNOW I'm right) ;)


WATCH
Last edited by Devil505 on Thu Oct 30, 2008 2:50 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Guilt by Association. Hang the Man!!

PostBy: spc On: Thu Oct 30, 2008 2:49 pm

kootch88 wrote:What about his associations with Buffett, General Petraeus, Colin Powell

You do know the difference between associations & endorsements.
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Re: Guilt by Association. Hang the Man!!

PostBy: Devil505 On: Thu Oct 30, 2008 2:56 pm

spc wrote:You do know the difference between associations & endorsements.



I know that one teacher!!



(clears his throat)


Endorsement is what John McCain sought from reverend Hagee who praised Adolf Hitler for murdering millions of Jews.


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/05/2 ... 02892.html
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Re: Guilt by Association. Hang the Man!!

PostBy: kootch88 On: Thu Oct 30, 2008 2:58 pm

What about his associations with Buffett, General Petraeus, Colin Powell

You do know the difference between associations & endorsements.


I sure do know the difference, but these folks aren't just endorsers, they are close associates, advisors and people who influence Obama, at least that is what he says, but that is probaboly a lie right? :no1:
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