Convert from HVAC LP to Koker Keystoker Coal Furnace

PostBy: coaledsweat On: Fri Mar 02, 2007 2:53 pm

I think if you are running a stoker you would have more time to spend with girls and not spend it with your heating appliance, is this the implication here?
coaledsweat
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Axeman Anderson 260M
Coal Size/Type: Pea

PostBy: stockingfull On: Fri Mar 02, 2007 2:57 pm

:grouphuuug:

Girlie Men Unite!

:greenjumpers:
stockingfull
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Yellow Flame
Stove/Furnace Model: W.A. 150 Stoker Furnace

PostBy: stockingfull On: Fri Mar 02, 2007 3:07 pm

coaledsweat wrote:I think if you are running a stoker you would have more time to spend with girls and not spend it with your heating appliance, is this the implication here?


:headbang:

Or, put another way, "girlie men" need to shower only once a day! :smilebowtie:
stockingfull
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Yellow Flame
Stove/Furnace Model: W.A. 150 Stoker Furnace


PostBy: e.alleg On: Fri Mar 02, 2007 5:45 pm

I have been debating the stoker vs. Hitzer dilemma myself. The Hitzer heats just about every Amish house around here just fine. I figure a stoker is better because of #1 85% or better efficiency vs. about 60% for the Hitzer. #1b the stoker has a lower stack temp so less heat going out the chimney, #2 easier to keep it going, and #3 easier to hook up to a forced air system with a Keystoker furnace with insulated sides. Even at a 15% efficiency differential it won't take long to pay for the stoker in coal savings. True when the power goes out we'll be cold but it rarely goes off for long periods of time. If you want to be a real man you can't be dependent on your coal dealer or have any automation like a gravity hopper, a REAL manly man would weld up an iron box and cut and split wood to fill it every day and haul water up from the spring.
e.alleg
 
Stove/Furnace Make: EFM
Stove/Furnace Model: 520

PostBy: Richard S. On: Fri Mar 02, 2007 5:51 pm

There is another benefit of having a stoker not mentioned. It's not practical for most but if you have one of the larger furnace types with the hot water jacket you can run it year round, only have to mess with it every two weeks or so...

This of course would be impossible with a had fired unit, also brings up another thought. I'd imagine a stoker is much more efficient during warmer times of the year, it can just idle along.
Richard S.
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Van Wert VA1200
Coal Size/Type: Buckwheat/Anthracite

PostBy: stockingfull On: Fri Mar 02, 2007 6:11 pm

NEPAForum Admin wrote:There is another benefit of having a stoker not mentioned. It's not practical for most but if you have one of the larger furnace types with the hot water jacket you can run it year round, only have to mess with it every two weeks or so...

This of course would be impossible with a had fired unit, also brings up another thought. I'd imagine a stoker is much more efficient during warmer times of the year, it can just idle along.


Mine doesn't like to idle along for long in warmer weather. I think it's for some combination of two reasons: (1) the fire doesn't stay hot enough to have the "margin" to "rev up" when it's needed; and (2) there isn't sufficient draw up the flue to keep a slow fire going. My experience has been that, when it gets much above 55 degrees, "it's hard to keep the old fire going."
stockingfull
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Yellow Flame
Stove/Furnace Model: W.A. 150 Stoker Furnace

PostBy: e.alleg On: Fri Mar 02, 2007 9:48 pm

I like the idea of having a fire going in the summer, it's a good excuse to stay warm during the warm season. Some of us live in places where it gets down to 45-50 degrees in the summer pretty regularly and because I'm not wealthy I don't run the furnace during "summer" but 45 and raining is cold brother. :idea:
e.alleg
 
Stove/Furnace Make: EFM
Stove/Furnace Model: 520

PostBy: keyman512us On: Sat Mar 03, 2007 7:13 am

Hey all..I'm LMAO at the "Girlie vs. non"...only in this forum...lol
Some of us live in places where it gets down to 45-50 degrees in the summer pretty regularly

Amen to that my friend! Sitting here on top of the hill in North County summer nights can be somewhat chilly. Last year "summer" arrived late, didn't get warm until almost the first part of July...A 4-6 hour burn in the "outdoor unit" did the trick though (wood fired...had I used coal earlier I would have ran it all summer) but alas that option is now history...local ordinance now restricts outdoor units (because of OWB's)from May15th to Sept 15th...coulda,woulda,shoulda!
...I think I just came up with a new forum topic...lol
keyman512us
 

PostBy: dirvine96 On: Sat Mar 03, 2007 11:56 am

lets say you burn 5 tons a year with the Hitzer or any other hopper or hand fed stove. Lets keep it simple, $200 a ton. Even if you burn only 4 ton with a stoker the pay back is long term. I'll go back to my original point. A keystoker $3000 plus venter $3500 Plus install. I'll bet your close to 5 grand. The Hitzer with masonary chimney installed less than 3 gran for sure. Closer to $2500. We'll split the diff. $2750. $ 2250 difference in upfront cost. In coal alone it will take 9 years to pay that money back. And you still can't heat your house when the electric goes out.

You could take that $2250 and take the family to Florida or go to Shamokin and tour an old mine and then take the kids to Kanobbles. Buy silver or invest it.

Don't get me wrong stroker are great. Less work and they burn very eff, but in todays world you need to look at what the real payback is and is it worth the time.

Hand fed men unite. Real men shovel and shake.
dirvine96
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Hitzer 82FA

PostBy: stockingfull On: Sat Mar 03, 2007 12:44 pm

dirvine96 wrote: In coal alone it will take 9 years to pay that money back. And you still can't heat your house when the electric goes out.

You could take that $2250 and take the family to Florida or go to Shamokin and tour an old mine and then take the kids to Kanobbles. Buy silver or invest it.

Don't get me wrong stroker are great. Less work and they burn very eff, but in todays world you need to look at what the real payback is and is it worth the time.

Hand fed men unite. Real men shovel and shake.


But just think of the number of showers you'd save w/ a stoker. :mrgreen:

Seriously, we girlie men have gotten in touch with our civilized sides; personally, I'm looking for even more automation on both the supply- and ash-removal-sides. And I'm already saving so much, compared to oil, propane or gas, that it'd be easy to justify paying for a "maintenance-free" (or nearly :wink: ) system.

So, for me, it's not what the absolute cheapest heating solution is; it's how to take the vast savings of coal and pursue the most user-friendly setup.

Now, I realize that, for those who already have a stove and chimney in place, some of those increments may be hard to pursue. Every situation is different.

But, in the long run, the way coal breaks through as a mainstream home heating source is (a) by lengthening the tending intervals, and (b) when the ladies can no longer complain about the fuel and ash being lugged around inside the living spaces of our homes. That is, by becoming more civilized.

That's the "girlie man" creed. :band:
stockingfull
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Yellow Flame
Stove/Furnace Model: W.A. 150 Stoker Furnace

PostBy: e.alleg On: Sat Mar 03, 2007 11:07 pm

For me a stove like the Hitzer just doesn't make sense though, I don't want my basement 90 degrees where nobody lives and the 2nd floor bedrooms 40 degrees. I suppose I could make up some ductwork to fit over the stove and set up a blower but we are right back at square one with the costs.
e.alleg
 
Stove/Furnace Make: EFM
Stove/Furnace Model: 520

PostBy: dirvine96 On: Sun Mar 04, 2007 10:37 am

e.alleg wrote

I don't want my basement 90 degrees where nobody lives and the 2nd floor bedrooms 40 degrees. I suppose I could make up some ductwork to fit over the stove and set up a blower but we are right back at square one with the costs


His home is very comfortable. The costs I quoted in my previous post are right on.

stockingfull wrote

So, for me, it's not what the absolute cheapest heating solution is; it's how to take the vast savings of coal and pursue the most user-friendly setup



This is what makes this site so good. Coal is not main stream and every one has a different reason for make the jump to coal. Most people I tell that I heat with coal think I'm going back to the stone age. I think its just the oposite. I'm not dependent on the man. Big energy.

The stoker v. hand fed is a great debate. Like I've said all along I wish I had found this site before I made the jump to coal. I hope other people that are considering coal do find us and read all the great info and points of view. I think it only helps the growth of coal burning. Its great that you can get in for a small investment or go all out and spend the big bucks.

Lets hear from some shovelers and shakers. I know your out there.

Don
dirvine96
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Hitzer 82FA

PostBy: Richard S. On: Sun Mar 04, 2007 11:02 am

stockingfull wrote:Mine doesn't like to idle along for long in warmer weather.


You need a timer, it kicks the furnace on for a few minutes each hour. In the summer that would be the only time it will run.
Richard S.
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Van Wert VA1200
Coal Size/Type: Buckwheat/Anthracite

PostBy: stockingfull On: Sun Mar 04, 2007 2:04 pm

NEPAForum Admin wrote:
stockingfull wrote:Mine doesn't like to idle along for long in warmer weather.


You need a timer, it kicks the furnace on for a few minutes each hour. In the summer that would be the only time it will run.


Have one; 30-minute cycle. I have it set to stoke for about a minute every ten minutes.

But when it's not cold enough to get a decent draw up the flue, what can you do?
stockingfull
 
Stove/Furnace Make: Yellow Flame
Stove/Furnace Model: W.A. 150 Stoker Furnace

PostBy: coaledsweat On: Sun Mar 04, 2007 2:20 pm

Taller chimney.
coaledsweat
 
Stoker Coal Boiler: Axeman Anderson 260M
Coal Size/Type: Pea