New Assault weapon Ban

If a person who lives in our society wants a gun I say give it to them.If he or she is a danger to society then what are they doing out in society?
DON

pvolcko wrote:ou seem to be willing to ignore the mountain of evidence of liberal Democrat intent on severely limiting gun ownership, hunting and shooting sports, and even home self defense (much less self-defense while out and about) through ever increasing permit fees, dealer fees, dealer regulations and laws, gun range zoning and property taxing, distance from schools laws, distance from homes for discharge regs, time limited renewable permit schemes, caliber limit laws, semi-auto limitations and ban proposals, gun registration schemes, broader and broader ballistics cartridge case database schemes, gun and ammo specific excise taxes from anywhere up to 150% and more, and on and on.

You call those "liberal Democrat" intentions.....I'd call allot of that common sense. "distance from schools laws".....should we allow hunting in school yards?....."gun range zoning and property taxing,"......Should profit making gun ranges be tax exempt?...Should there be no zoning restrictions? (how about setting up a firing range shooting across a major interstate highway, for the fun of it?)

pvolcko wrote:And for the love of God, please stop with the flame thrower and nuclear weapon thing.

Hey......It's a free country!! (I love to throw those in just to get a rise out of you Paul!! ....Works every time!!....& it does make my point, albeit with a bit of exaggeration & tongue in cheek))

BIG BEAM wrote:If a person who lives in our society wants a gun I say give it to them.If he or she is a danger to society then what are they doing out in society?
DON

There are plenty of criminals walking the streets as it is. That they exist in our society is a fact. Giving them easier access to firearms than they already have is not something I want to do.

Why are thay walking around in society? isn't that a problem that needs to be fixed?

I don't care if a guy is walking down the hallway in a school with a 15 shot 9MM if it's in his holster.After all wouldn,t most cops in a school be armed and we trust them.Shouldn't a government trust it's people ?

pvolcko wrote:Lastly, in so far as the NRA ibeing funded and supported in part by gun manufacturers and thus represent their agenda to some extent, I'm completely fine with that.

So am I Paul. I only argue against those who refuse to admit or just don't understand what the NRA really is. They are a gun lobby for the firearms industry. Nothing wrong with that any more than the Insurance industry's lobby, or the Morticians lobby, or the Flower Grower's lobby's watching out for the interests of their industry's in Congress & occasionally providing a public service through education as well. What I argue against is the idea, that many people have, that the NRA is really a Constitutional Rights organization, MAINLY interested in fighting for us gun owners to keep our rights!! They aren't........They are there to make sure that we keep buying products made by & for the firearms industry. You & I understand that Paul, but not everyone does.

Hey you don't have to buy this stuff................but you are able to do so.................for now

BIG BEAM wrote:Why are thay walking around in society? isn't that a problem that needs to be fixed?

Absolutely!! But we also have a few other problems to fix:
1. People need to be kind to each other
2. No more cheating
3. Let's stop all lying
4. No J-walking
5. No more over-eating!
6. Less garbage & more flowers in the world


When you find that society Big Beam.......make sure you call me with the address!

BIG BEAM"

]I don't care if a guy is walking down the hallway in a school with a 15 shot 9MM if it's in his holster.[/quote]



I do


[quote="BIG BEAM wrote:Shouldn't a government trust it's people ?

Like Ronald Reagan said: "Trust.........But verify!"

Devil, what is your opinion of the death penalty? I'll tell you that I am pro death penalty. An eye for an eye. If you J-walk I don't think you should be put to death................you murder someone then you die.

Now everyone. ....Just remember we have Police dont we? .....And they are here to serve and protect ...And if you call 911 on a landline(cells dont like 911) they might get to before you bleed to death and in plenty of time to get your report before you die
But if you want protection get a nice large smart barking dog and a keep a pistol in grabbing distance
It would be nice world if everyone lived by a Golden Rule of some sort.....but everyone doesnt ....
Administration Of Change?? This one is starting off like all the rest of the Democrats.. bringing guns up before they even are in Washington.
I should think the Super Lefties should spend time on worries about our "worse than we even know" banking disater thats not even begun to unravel.
Now when you "Bunny Frank" sayings we should keep secrets from the public "for fear idf it causing more crashes.....whats that tell you about CHANGE??? LIARS ALL POLITICIANS ARE LIARS

Devil505 wrote:The counter argument is that, since we live in a crowded society, it is really not debatable that we have a collective right to defend ourselves against danger.

That's the twist - "crowded" is a relative term. Metro NYC, yes, crowded, difficult to get possession permit. My friends in Iowa (town pop. 3200, one stoplight) have no problem getting ownership permit if they pass background check. Concealed carry requires extra paperwork but it's not flat *out of the question*.

What makes a legally owned gun (or owner) more dangerous in NYC than in Iowa?

Devil505 wrote:So what we do as a society is weigh the usefulness of the "potentially dangerous" thing against it's usefulness to us as a society. The car obviously has a much greater usefulness than danger to us & so does the baseball bat as a sporting device. What is the societal usefulness of a flame thrower, armor piercing ammo or the like??

That's the same as the "needs" argument. The usefulness of guns has nothing to do with owning one; the person holding a gun determines its use, lawful or unlawful. It looks like this is where we disagree.

Legally owned, properly secured, firearms in the hands of a properly trained individual pose no threat to a free society. You can argue the "owner goes nuts" case but that may be a price of living in a free society. If a gun was involved in the "goes nuts" case it only made it _easier_ not avoidable.

Devil505 wrote:When you argue that a flame thrower would be fine in Times Square, you are entitled to your opinion, but WE citizens are entitled to disagree with you & band together & make it illegal to do so.

Conceptual question, conceptual answer. Flame throwers and nukes had nothing to do with the topic of this thread.

This thread has diverged, but it started with "the anti gun lobby is trying to pass a revamped Assault weapons ban". Which is simply not true. No one has citied a specific bill in either house that is doing such.

I actually bought a gun today. The last gun I bought went like this. " Take the gun home and try it. If you like it come back and pay me ". Not so today.

TSB

Devil
I don't think any of what you just mentioned constitutes a danger to society.Just like ANY firearm,knife,bat,stick,rock or any other thing that can be used as a weapon is a danger to society.But if someone is a danger to society I don't want him or her among us.Period !

The sooner we realize that people(bad people) are the problem and not the weapon the better off we'll be.And the sooner we get those people out of society the safer we'll be.

If we took ALL the guns away from all the honest people the criminals would still get weapons even if they had to make them or steal them from another country.

The problem has always been and will always be bad people and it is NEVER the bullet,gun,bat,stick,rock or knifes fault.It's really that simple.
DON

TimV wrote:Now everyone. ....Just remember we have Police dont we? .....And they are here to serve and protect ...And if you call 911 on a landline(cells dont like 911) they might get to before you bleed to death and in plenty of time to get your report before you die
But if you want protection get a nice large smart barking dog and a keep a pistol in grabbing distance
It would be nice world if everyone lived by a Golden Rule of some sort.....but everyone doesnt ....
Administration Of Change?? This one is starting off like all the rest of the Democrats.. bringing guns up before they even are in Washington.
I should think the Super Lefties should spend time on worries about our "worse than we even know" banking disater thats not even begun to unravel.
Now when you "Bunny Frank" sayings we should keep secrets from the public "for fear idf it causing more crashes.....whats that tell you about CHANGE??? LIARS ALL POLITICIANS ARE LIARS

Now Now we can't have dogs anymore.Alot of insurance co. won't even write a homeowners policy if you have a beagle.
DON

SuperBeetle wrote:Devil, what is your opinion of the death penalty? I'll tell you that I am pro death penalty. An eye for an eye. If you J-walk I don't think you should be put to death................you murder someone then you die.

Absolutely in favor of the death penalty.

Now here we differ.I don't believe in the death penalty.The court and criminal justice system is just to corrupt the way it stands now.
DON