Keystoker Problems...and I Thought I Was a Pro.

hi all
im having some troubles with my keystoker.
i started it up about a month ago and things were fine until yesterday.
it stopped throwing heat.
ive noticed the internal temp wasnt reaching the 160 which trips the fan limit switch on... so I went and bought a new fan limit switch thinking that was the problem.
now I know it cant be.
the thermostat is calling for heat...(oh yea, I replaced that, too). a green and red button goes on in the back of the stove showing the tt is calling for heat. that trips the gear motor to throw coal. it is throwing coal but the temp isnt getting high in the stoker.. its staying about 130 (I need 160 in order for the blower unit to turn on) it shuts down at 110. I do have an auto feeder which stays on for about 1 1/2 minutes per 10 minutes but why isnt this fire as hot as it was??
I don't get it? when I went to the dealer for the fan limit switch he couldnt believe that I needed a new one. he said he never had one go bad. so maybe that wasnt the problem.. but anyway I now have a new one.. it's going to get real cold here by Tuesday and I have no clue as to what on earth to do now.
any help is appreciated.
peace
boxer

Hello boxer,, how much fire is on the grate?? This is a newer keystoker, so the combustion fan should be running full time. When the thermostat calls for heat, are you saying that the stoker pushes some more coal on the grate then quits? or,, are you saying it doesn't push any coal onto the grate at all??

If the stoker is running but not pushing enough coal out, you could have an oversize piece or two of coal, or a piece of wood in the coal on top of the stoker mechanism, blocking coal from feeding out of the hopper... the only way to find if this is the problem is to empty the hopper and take a look.. Some coal will have a few oversize pieces and an occasional piece of wood from the mine in the mix..

If the stoker runs, pushes a little coal then stops.. then I'd say it is either an electical problem or maybe a problem with the stoker motor..

If the stoker is pushing fresh coal, but it isn't burning very hot, check to see if the combustion blower is running, this forces air through the grate from below the fire.. this blower usually has an adjustable flapper over the fan inlet,, has this moved?? maybe try opening it a bit more to admit more air to the fire..

With the pusher pushing coal, and a lower temp, you must have unburnt coal in the ash??

Did you change coal suppliers??

Have you ever cleaned the fines out from under the grate?? you can remove the combustion blower and vacuum out the space below the grates..

We need a bit more info to help..

Describe the fire size,
Describe the fans that are or are not running [other than the heat distribution fan]
Describe the amount of fresh coal pushed out with the timed run vs the thermostat call for heat..
Describe the amound of ash, fire and fresh coal on the grate..

With this info one of us should be able to help..

Greg L

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Boxer,

It could also be that underneath the feed ramp has a build up of fines (sand) not allowing enough air through the holes to get high temps on the fire. The grates need to occasionally be pulled out and the underneath area vacuumed out. When you replace the grates you have to use furnace cement on all the joints between the grates and the feed ramp to prevent air from getting out. The cement goes as far forward as where the air holes start. Failure to do this WILL result in a hopper fire. While you are doing that, check all of the little air holes to make sure they are all clear. Use a piece of wire to clean them, if needed.

Mike

thanks guys

well..first off I should run down stairs and tell hubby to not start it cause I did clean under the grate and didnt understand the cement thingy... how do I do that???

whats happening is
the thermostat is calling for heat...
coal is coming on the grate but it's only like a maintance fire. the gear motor kicks on when the therm. calls for heat which then sends for the coal and there is about 2 inches behind the fire of unlit coal. as for coal not burning..is't all ash!! no unburnt coal at all. Im using the same coal as the keystoker dealer and so far it's great stuff!!
The combustion fan is running constantly...factory preset. the furnace is only a year old..(bought it used)
I just cleaned EVERYTHING!! and I look like a coal miner myself..(football day for the man of the house!)
but what I don't get.. if the thermostat is calling for heat..
it kicks on the gear motor to throw coal.
the gear motor runs until theres about 3 inches behind the fire which burns slowly.
but although I still need heat.. the gear motor stops and the coal stops..and the green and red buttons still on in the back which is supposed to make the gear motor run.. should it shut off without reaching the temp. required?
gosh.
like I said..
i just shop vac'd the whole entire thing.. greased everything and am starting over.
under the grates..behind the motor.. everywhere..
hopfully by tomorrow I'll have it running.
thanks for your help.. i'll let yas know
peace
boxer

Boxer,

You said that you cleaned and greased everything.

Did you change the feed setting on the back of the stove ????

Isn't there a nut or something on the back which controls how much coal is being fed by the stoker motor ?? A month ago you did not need much heat, which means less to feed, but now you do so maybe the feed needs to be increased. I believe there is some type of adjustment on the back of them.

-----------------------------------------------------------

Rick

I backed off my feed rate on my Koker significantly to achieve a 1" (barely) fire on idle. But when the t-stat calls for heat, the stoker keeps pushing until the desired temp is met. I found that it might take a little longer to come up to the set temp. But it does reach it fine w/out readjusting the feed rate.

Does yours have a relay box that the thermostat is plugged into? Can you hear it clicking on/off when you move the thermostat to call for heat?
The Stoker motor should continue to run when the thermostat is turned up and until heat is satisfied, the motor should keep running.

You can adjust your convection fan, if it has the black box on the side of the stove, you can open the case and adjust the setpoints, move the setpoint down a bit. I think it's on at 160 off at 100 or something. You can lower it down to 140 or so, then it will kick on quicker.

How much higher are you setting the temp when the stoker motor kicks on? Is it 1 or 2 degrees? maybe it is satisfying it and turning off. Maybe move it 5 or so degrees to make sure it stays on.

Make sure the FEED adjust screw is turned in ALL the WAY and backed out 2 turns to start.

ok
this is what im going to do..
first off to answer questions..
i can't start the fire until I get this cement on the grates...right? when I did remove the grates it really didnt look like cement was on there to begin with..but I could be wrong.
i called keystoker this am and he said the same thing wny said.. turn the screw all the way in and back off two turns..

one thing I havent been doing is shutting the t-stat down when I shut the stove off. I had to shut it all down last night due to the fret of a hopper fire.
everything on the stoker is factory set..even the draft so I didnt want to mess with it.

but
when it does call for heat shouldnt a nice flame be in the stoker???
I look at all your avatars and everyone has a beautiful flame in the stoker... mine is just a dim glow.
i just font get it.
i replaced the t-stat and fan limit relay box Friday.
The gear motor does run when I turn the t-stat on to call for heat but it never reaches the desired temp and about 10 minutes into it the gear shuts down (but the red and green light on the relay is still on which I thiught if its calling for heat the gear should keep running.)
i don't know.
im going to clean out the hopper AGAIN
and go and cement the grates in...
i'll keep ya'll posted..

when it does work my house is HOT!!!
I guess Im the one thats broken.
thanks
boxer

well I think I figured it out.

like I said.. I did take keystones advice and got the grates cemented in and set the feed as wny told me to.
what the problem is is the gear motor.
yes it gets its power from the relay box where the tt calls for heat... the fan that moves the gear motor is shorting out. I tapped the box where the wires run into and out of and that kicked the gear motor on. there has been a constant suppy of coal and the stoker is reaching 160 about every 10 minutes.(YAY!) Im guessing the feed motor is good if it runs, right?? and Im probably going to have to find out where the short is in the wires??? (I hate dealing with electricity!) but... its worth the heat. as I said I can't imagine life without a coal stove and I have no clue as to why I ever even put up with oil.
thanks to everyone who came to my rescue..
you all are great!!!
here's to a warm winter!!!
peace
and
thanks
Boxer

It could be the Relay Box that the stoker/thermostat is hooked into or the Thermostat Wiring? The cover on the thermostat housing should be removable, unplug the stove and check all the screw terminals in it, maybe one is loose, or check any WIRE NUTS where things are hooked up, maybe they are not making good contact too!!

Anything else, just ask!!

First thing I'd do is turn the power off & tug each wire that's in a wire nut. It's easy to have one twisted in that isn't tight.

well
here be the update.
i got the house to 74 last night!!
My 10 yo son actually woke this am and said it was too dang hot!! (I don't think that's ever possible for my cold blood!)
I shut it down this afternoon and ya'll were right.
I tugged at the wires under the caps and that was it!!!
To think that with this stoker .. if something goes wrong it has to be one thing or the other.. Like common sense.
Im just amazed Ive learned so much about coal and keystokes in the past few months that Im dang proud of myself.
thanks to everyone again.
i really do appreciate the help.
peace
boxer

Just a quick comment, since you found loose wires this probably doesn't apply.. But... when you tapped on the motor/ relay box or whatever,, you may have jarred the stoker /pusher mechanism loose.. it may have been jammed with fines or small pieces of coal..

Take a look at the motor moving the pusher/stoker mechanism now while it is working,, look at how the motor moves the mechanism.. if it stops again, try to move the mechanism by hand, if it doesn't move freely, it may need a quick vacuum or a manual [by hand] push to get started.. The Keystoker pusher block has nylon guide screws that are prone to wear, and breakage. This may be some of the problem..

Greg L

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