Coal Neophyite Draft/Fire Control

 
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Michacite
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Location: Michigan

Post by Michacite » Mon. Jan. 19, 2009 11:31 pm

Thanks for your help - first pictures - I just found my camera battery charger that has been missing since Christmas. So it is charging. I will get a picture on it tomorrow.

Shaking - What we have been doing is shaking until we get small red hot coals in the bottom, and can see the glow from above. Is that right, that is what the manual said we should do.

The air inlets on the fuel loading door - we turn these until they close, and then open them 1/4 turn. The damper/flapper on the bottom ash pan is what the thermostat kicks on, this has two small holes in the door with another cover that you can turn. We have kept this open all the way. We tried it part way closed at first. and then half way, and finally progressed to full open.

We had been slowly building up the coal bed, one course thick until it reached the top of the bricks (about 8-10"s). This would take a couple of hours, each course taking about 15 minutes or so. We would shake it down about 4 times times during that process. The amount of coal that we put in is about 100 to 125 pounds.

The coal in the morning is about 40% ash to 60% coal. Harman says that the draft should be .06.

As far as chimney's each stove has its own SS chimney. (way too much money on stoves and chimneys. I kept adding them to get the house warmer, silly me should have gone central heat a lot sooner)

I sure appreciate your help, and expertise. Coal is a heck of a lot different than wood. The Harman will eat up the wood alive. The burn times are not as long, but there is no problem with the draft for wood.

Thanks again, and I will get the pictures posted tomorrow evening.

Jim

 
Morith
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Post by Morith » Tue. Jan. 20, 2009 4:22 pm

I am no expert. The draft thing is a mystery. Burning coal is an art. Apply some logic to your problem by systematically eliminating the variables. I can't tell you how many times I have come upstairs from working on my furnace and announcing to my wife that I have figured it out only to eat my words before the week is out. Draft is tricky. Watch your readings throughout a whole burning cycle. It may help you to figure out what is going on. Good Luck!
Morith


 
rberq
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Hand Fed Coal Stove: DS Machine 1300 with hopper
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Other Heating: Oil hot water radiators (fuel oil); propane

Post by rberq » Tue. Jan. 20, 2009 6:41 pm

OK, no guarantees, but here's what I would recommend that you try:
Michacite wrote: Shaking - What we have been doing is shaking until we get small red hot coals in the bottom, and can see the glow from above

Before you start shaking, open up the ash door for a few minutes and make sure you have a good healthy burn going so you won't risk killing the fire. Shake more, until you get some half-inch burning coals dropping. You will be wasting a few ounces of coal, but so what? Poke from below until you get a good glow over most of the grate area.
Michacite wrote: The air inlets on the fuel loading door - we turn these until they close, and then open them 1/4 turn.

That's maybe OK while reloading and building up a fire in the new coal (see below). But once the new fire is healthy, close them COMPLETELY. My primary air inlet is the same as one of these two spinners, and a quarter turn on just the one spinner makes two hundred degrees difference in my stove temperature. So it's a lot of air you are letting in above the fire, which can only do harm, not good.
Michacite wrote: The damper/flapper ... has two small holes in the door with another cover that you can turn. We have kept this open all the way.

If your stove pipe temperature stays up around 180 or 200 (below the baro) or 110-120 above the baro, then that's fine. If the stovepipe temp falls lower than that over the course of an hour or two, the coal is not getting enough air to maintain an idling fire. In that case put a paper clip or something on the main air inlet so it can't close all the way, to give it more air. You will have to experiment with this; let the stove pipe surface temp be your guide. This may be what your dealer meant by "modifying" the air inlet.
Michacite wrote:We had been slowly building up the coal bed, one course thick until it reached the top of the bricks (about 8-10"s). This would take a couple of hours, each course taking about 15 minutes or so. We would shake it down about 4 times times during that process.
You are working too hard. Shake it down thoroughly, once, as described above. Make sure the coal that's left is burning vigorously, either by leaving the ash door open for a few minutes or by opening the main air inlet all the way. Then add the new coal in maybe two courses five to fifteen minutes apart. With the main inlet fully open, and the upper door spinners open a quarter turn each, it shouldn't take more than a few minutes to get the new coal flaming nicely. Your biggest danger here is getting a puff-back, where too much gas builds up above the coal bed and then ignites with a bang. During this phase, I slowly open the load door every minute or so and close it slowly, until at some point the gas/air mix ignites (usually) gently. Once the flames are self-sustaining, give it a few more minutes with lots of air, then repeat for the second course of coal. Keep an eye on the stove pipe temps, you probably don't want much over 350 below the baro or 220 above it.

Again, once the flames are vigorous and self-sustaining, CLOSE THE SPINNERS on the upper door COMPLETELY. Your goal here is to have the whole coal bed burning, at least up to within a couple inches of the top. You may still see dark coal across the top, but you should be able to see some bright red ones showing through. Yeah, it may be more heat than you need right then, but once the whole coal bed is healthily burning, now you set the air inlet thermostat back to its normal position. The fire will be throttled back over the next 5 to 15 minutes and reach its "steady state" where it idles along until later when the thermostat calls for heat.
Michacite wrote: The coal in the morning is about 40% ash to 60% coal. Harman says that the draft should be .06.
To start with, try a bit higher draft, maybe set the baro to its highest setting which is probably .08. Once you have tamed the beast you can experiment with lower settings.

 
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Michacite
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Post by Michacite » Tue. Jan. 20, 2009 8:25 pm

Ah, thanks for the help and encouragement :D I will try all of the counsel and get back with you and let you guys know how it goes. I hope to get pictures on, but just got home from a long day at work.

This is a whole new world for me, and I like the idea about too much work! The process is art, and I must be patient I know. Thanks for coming forward with advice. I am amazed at the difference in the temp of having the knobs shut. :o

Thanks guys for your help. I felt like I was hitting a wall with this process and lacking knowledge, and people I could get advice from.

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