High Winds, Cold & Back Draft

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xaos
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Post by xaos » Mon. Dec. 22, 2008 7:01 am

Last night we had high winds and cold temps..
I couldn't even open my stove door to load, smoke would pour out??
I would quickly throw in a shovel full and I would get smoke coming out of the flue pipe joints..
I also had to shut down the power vent for the stove also I usually have it on low but when it kicked on smoke came out of the furnace intake vents..
I have a masonry chimney in the center of the house..
I do not have a chimney cap on it, would that cause this type of back draft??

Needless to say I had to shut her down on the coldest night of the season..
Tonight I will disassemble the flue pipe to ensure there are no blockages..

Any suggestions??


 
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Post by coalkirk » Mon. Dec. 22, 2008 7:29 am

That's a bummer on a cold night like last night. Sure sounds like you've got a blockage. I'm trying to figure out why you've got a power vent if you have a masonry chimney in the center of the house. ??? Is this a lined chimney? How big? What size smoke pipe off of your coal burner?

 
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Post by WNY » Mon. Dec. 22, 2008 7:42 am

Yes, a cap may help, but you may have snow or a drift on top of your chimney cause the downdraft when the wind blows a certain way, did you have it cranking up so the heat was pulling up the chimney or was it low on heat?

 
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xaos
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Post by xaos » Mon. Dec. 22, 2008 7:47 am

Its a forced draft combustion blower unit that comes with the US Stove ashley 24A.
The chimney is brick with a terracotta 8x8 liner.
The furnace is a 6" black pipe..
The chimney is about 5' higher than the peak of my roof.
My house is higher than both neighbors on either side.
I do have some trees across the street ..
I have been burning for a month straight now, this is the first real major back draft issue..

 
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CoalHeat
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Post by CoalHeat » Mon. Dec. 22, 2008 7:51 am

I would get smoke coming out of the flue pipe joints.
What are you burning? Anthracite produces no smoke.

If you are using a chimney it sounds like the extreme cold got into the chimney and cooled it off. In that case you need to get a roaring wood fire going first to heat up the flue, then let the coal take over. I loose considerable draft on very cold days when the hand-fed burns too low, I lock the baro closed and throw some wood in the stove to get the chimney warmed back up before adding more coal.

 
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Post by xaos » Mon. Dec. 22, 2008 8:27 am

Wood'nCoal wrote:
I would get smoke coming out of the flue pipe joints.
What are you burning? Anthracite produces no smoke.

If you are using a chimney it sounds like the extreme cold got into the chimney and cooled it off. In that case you need to get a roaring wood fire going first to heat up the flue, then let the coal take over. I loose considerable draft on very cold days when the hand-fed burns too low, I lock the baro closed and throw some wood in the stove to get the chimney warmed back up before adding more coal.
I am using Pittsburgh Nut Bit Coal..
I am going to get some Chestnut Anthracite this weekend.
We had the stove going above idle but not full tilt..
Didn't have any trouble until the temp drop and high winds in the early evening..
Soon as I reload it would start.
I probably could have fired it back up this morning , still some red amber's going and the shell was still warm.

I just don't want that to happen again. It started to back puff so much the the smoke detector went off.
I opened the ash door and it stopped, but returned later.
I guess I got scared, and just shut her down..
Should I invest in a chimney cap or just use four bricks and a flat stone on top..

 
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Post by CoalHeat » Mon. Dec. 22, 2008 9:08 am

Ah, that explains the smoke. Since I have no experience with Bit I'll leave it to the other members to comment on it.

A chimney cap will help some, I have them mostly to keep the rain and critters out of the flues.

Remember that when the chimney flue cools off and it's extremely cold out the cold air is trying to push down the flue, and the hot exhaust is trying to flow up the flue. Once the hot gases drop to a certain point, the battle is lost. That's why you need to keep a hot fire going, or start a roaring wood fire to heat up the flue and get things moving first. Running the combustion blower will add to the smoke if the chimney isn't drafting well.
We had the stove going above idle but not full tilt..
Get a big fire going in there and see what happens. High winds will usually increase the draft, it's the Veturi Effect- sometimes a gust can cause a downdraft.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Venturi_effect

Also, you need to have enough make-up air flowing into the area where the appliance is. If the house is sealed up tight it will add to your draft problems.

When the fire burns low and you are rebuilding it you should cover the baro damper with foil to get full draft to the fire. Just make sure you uncover it once the fire is established.

Hopefully someone will comment on Bit coal.


 
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Post by xaos » Mon. Dec. 22, 2008 9:25 am

Also, you need to have enough make-up air flowing into the area where the appliance is. If the house is sealed up tight it will add to your draft problems.
Its an older home and the furnace is in the basement..
I'm using the original chimney that was used in the good old coal burning days from the original coal furnace..

Anyone have a suggestion on a good chimney cap for drafts..

Could the configuration of the smoke pipe cause this..
It comes out of the back about 2.5'- 90* up about 3'- then 22* about 18" into chimney..
It does not go in to deep into the flue..

 
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Post by WNY » Mon. Dec. 22, 2008 12:36 pm

that should work fine, shouldn't effect it too much and It shouldn't go deep into the flue, the pipe or collar should only be even with the inside of the flue.

 
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Post by Flyer5 » Mon. Dec. 22, 2008 7:32 pm

Could the chimney or pipe be blocked from burning Bit ?Dave

 
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Post by xaos » Mon. Dec. 22, 2008 9:12 pm

Flyer5 wrote:Could the chimney or pipe be blocked from burning Bit ?Dave
I believe it was..
I disassembled the black pipe and found my manual damper failed closed.. :oops2:
I have removed it and I am testing the furnace now.
Started a real hot fire to burn out the soot and all is well so far..

 
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Post by CoalHeat » Mon. Dec. 22, 2008 9:56 pm

found my manual damper failed closed..
Glad you found the problem.

 
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Post by Freddy » Tue. Dec. 23, 2008 3:48 am

I'm glad you found the problem, but do you have two CO detectors? This issue could have easily caused your death. Sorry to be so blunt, but CO detectors are SO important!

 
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Post by coalkirk » Tue. Dec. 23, 2008 7:29 am

Doesn't the manual damper have a handle outside of the pipe that shows you what direction it is in? Like Freddy said, you are lucky you didn't wake up dead. I don't know squat about bit coal. no manual dampers for anthracite if your burning in a modern stove. Glad you and your family are ok.

 
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Post by xaos » Tue. Dec. 23, 2008 7:59 am

Yes,
I have a combo smoke /co2 detector in the cellar stair and a regulasr cos on the main floor..

as far as the manual damper..
The handle is supposed to show direction,
But as I stated it failed..
The handle did not turn the damper, the handle was turning but the damper was closed and jammed in that position..
My son was running the furnace while I was away at camp.
I figure he forgot to adjust it had a hot fire going and it lodged it in a closed position..
When I returned home that's when the weather got bad, winds picked up and temps dropped..
I had no idea there was a problem with the manual damper,

Anyway its been removed..

Thank you all for your concern..
I am still learning and reading and learning..
Hopefully someone whom is as unexperienced as I will learn a good lesson from my experience...

Merry Christmas to All!!


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