Should the USA have Universal Healthcare??

KLook wrote:Any idea how much we have already spent with no cures for many diseases? I don't. You make it sound like the cure when found will be a simple pill that costs a few bucks and can be made out of bee *censored*. Most cures we are going to find now for complex diseases will be expensive even if the magic stem cell treatments are found. Face it Devil, you and I are going to die from something someday, we can't keep everyone alive forever.

I know Jerry Lewis is real close to a cure.

Accountable to who? You? Me? They are elite and accountable to no one but themselves. You cannot fire them in the traditional sense of the word. Your best and only hope lies in the next election. The problem there is the other guy is just as self-centered as the idiot that now holds the office. They are not in your best interest.

I liken much of this to name recognition. Many moons ago I heard something about any recognition is good recognition. Even when a news piece is about bad things, the name sticks in people's heads. Take Kennedy for instance. How does Massachusetts keep electing him? Simple, he has name recognition. You and I cannot and will not change the process from where it is without a large revolt.

Aside from this issue, the minute they are elected they are already planning for the next election and everything done is done with that single notion in mind. What ever happened to fix the problem and get out?

Cabin, if you don't think a message can bring change in an election, you haven't been paying attention recently.

The whole reason this thread is going is because the last election did just that.

Uneducated Electorate Facilitates Abuse of The Constitution

"Freedom can exist only in the society of knowledge. Without learning, men are incapable of knowing their rights, and where learning is confined to a few people, liberty can be neither equal or universal. (Dr. Benjamin Rush - 1786)

It is reported that immediately after the Constitutional Convention as Benjamin Franklin was leaving the hall, a lady approached him and asked: "Mr. Franklin, what have you given us?" He replied: "A republic, if you can keep it."

http://cpidaho.org/archives/uneducated- ... stitution/

... which is why we use public tax dollars to build and run public schools.

So people can read and decide for themselves whom to vote for.

And they did that last November.

spc wrote:Uneducated Electorate Facilitates Abuse of The Constitution

Come on Stephen!....For a GW Bush apologist to warn about Constitutional abuse is like OJ Simpson warning about marital discord......... or Bernard Madoff giving lectures on ow to safely invest in the stock market.........or Jeffrey Dahmer writing a cookbook......or The Republican Party lecturing about how best to write a budget......or ....You get the point!

Read "Obama's Ultimate Agenda" by Charles Krauthammer

"Obama didn't get elected to warranty your muffler. He's here to warranty your life."

spc wrote:Read "Obama's Ultimate Agenda" by Charles Krauthammer

"Obama didn't get elected to warranty your muffler. He's here to warranty your life."

Why would anyone want to read something written by a Fox News guy who likes using torture????

Torture

In a December 5, 2005 in the Weekly Standard,[56] Krauthammer argues that any ban of torture must entail at least two exceptions. He claims that in both the situation of imminent danger (“ticking time bomb scenario”) or if it is believed that torture can procure life-saving information in the case of a high-level terrorist deeply involved in the planning of future attacks.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Krauthammer

You can't get all your news from Fox & think you know what's going on in the REAL WORLD Stephen. (Try CSPAN for a change)

stockingfull wrote:... which is why we use public tax dollars to build and run public schools.

So people can read and decide for themselves whom to vote for.

And they did that last November.

You don't believe what you just said do you? We spend billions on more on education than we used to and the kids are dumber than ever. How will they know who to vote for when they don't know how their government works? They stopped teaching "Civics" more than 30 years ago. Most people can't name their member of Congress much less their local representation. As a debate moderator told my friend during his Congressional run, "People don't care about the Constitution. What are you going to do for them?"

I'm 41 years old. I don't remember learning about how our government works but I can't say it didn't get taught. I was more interested in girls, or beer, or watching grass grow than government or how it works. At 16 or so the politicians were nothing more than old guys that were doing there best to move the drinking age to 21 for all of our safety of course.

As for an educated electorate, yeah, right Spent some time surfing YouTube the other night and fell into some Howard Stern interviews with folks from Harlem IIRC. The subject was the election. When someone would say they would vote for Obama the next question was, "What do you think about his running mate, Sarah Palin?"
All interviewees were pretty happy with his choice. The interviews were not limited to Obama supporters and were rephrased with the question "What do you think about his McCain's VP choice, Joe Biden?" when a McCain supporter arrived. Again, "That's a great choice!" was usually the answer. People aren't educated beyond sound bites.

I know some will dismiss Howard Stern but you can't dispute the answers from people.

It wasn't until I joined here that I started paying more attention to our political process or politics at all. I want to thank all of you for that whether your in the correct camp or Stocking's/Devil's side. I'll be honest and say that I couldn't name my fearless leaders either not long ago.

I can say that there is no way anyone can follow all of these ideas that politicians have. Just look at some of the bills Senators support, most are special interest bills. No wonder we're in the shape we are, no one can pay that much attention.

Seriously though I do appreciate all of your views.

jpete wrote:

stockingfull wrote:... which is why we use public tax dollars to build and run public schools.

So people can read and decide for themselves whom to vote for.

And they did that last November.

You don't believe what you just said do you? We spend billions on more on education than we used to and the kids are dumber than ever. How will they know who to vote for when they don't know how their government works? They stopped teaching "Civics" more than 30 years ago. Most people can't name their member of Congress much less their local representation. As a debate moderator told my friend during his Congressional run, "People don't care about the Constitution. What are you going to do for them?"

The point, Jeff, is that, if you want the educated public our system requires, you don't close public schools just because you have a problem with them.

That's called "throwing the baby out with the bath water."

An educated public is a necessity for our form of gov't. So it's in our public interest to have universal education. So we tax for that and pay for that and, as the President has promised, fix it when and where we need to. We don't abandon it or close it down.

The very same principle applies to public health. As almost all employers agree, a healthy workforce is more productive and less distracted. Why would that incentive apply less to the nation's gov't than it does to each employer providing health insurance?

The test is coming up; have you got the concept yet?

cabinover wrote:As for an educated electorate, yeah, right Spent some time surfing YouTube the other night and fell into some Howard Stern interviews with folks from Harlem IIRC.

The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter.
Winston Churchill


but then again.....

It has been said that democracy is the worst form of government except all the others that have been tried.
Winston Churchill

Devil505 wrote:

cabinover wrote:As for an educated electorate, yeah, right Spent some time surfing YouTube the other night and fell into some Howard Stern interviews with folks from Harlem IIRC.

The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter.
Winston Churchill


but then again.....

It has been said that democracy is the worst form of government except all the others that have been tried.
Winston Churchill

So true.

"Obama's Ultimate Agenda" by Charles Krauthammer

Forgot to post the link:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/co ... 03287.html

stockingfull wrote:The test is coming up; have you got the concept yet?

You're wasting your time with Jeff. I have yet to see him ever admit he was wrong or even that there's a possibility that he's wrong. (usually you won't even get an acknowledgment that he has read & understood your argument, let alone change his mind) He's not alone in that, as there are about 4 or 5 people here like that. I have admitted when I knew I was wrong, & even done so directly to jpete & sps on occasion. I also will often admit that I may be wrong. To be absolutely positive that your are always right is to be disingenuous at a minimum or to actually BE God. ...I am not the former & make no claim to be the latter.