Should the USA have Universal Healthcare??

Devil505 wrote:

Black_And_Blue wrote:

Devil505 wrote:
Why are you anti-socialist? (are you against our military having universal health care, for example?.....How about Social Security?)

Talk to the folks in countries that have universal health care. It fails miserably.

av8r wrote:

Devil505 wrote:
Why are you anti-socialist? (are you against our military having universal health care, for example?.....How about Social Security?)

Talk to the folks in countries that have universal health care. It fails miserably.

Really? So miserably that they've abolished it? Examples, please.

We have some Canadian members here. I would be interested to see if they would trade their system for ours. I don't think Obama wants a copy of the Canadian system, but a hybrid.

Let's find out whether the Canadians, or any other country, have ever abolished universal healthcare.

And, while we're at it, how about an example of a pure free market which pulled itself out of a depression.

I believe this is called CHECKMATE!


Frm wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_health_care

Universal health care is provided in all wealthy, industrialized countries, except for the United States.[1][2] It is also provided in many developing countries and is the trend worldwide.
Contents


* 1 History
* 2 Implementation
o 2.1 Americas
+ 2.1.1 Brazil
+ 2.1.2 Canada
+ 2.1.3 United States
o 2.2 Asia and Africa
+ 2.2.1 China
+ 2.2.2 India
+ 2.2.3 Israel
+ 2.2.4 Singapore
+ 2.2.5 Thailand
o 2.3 Europe
+ 2.3.1 Finland
+ 2.3.2 Germany
+ 2.3.3 The Netherlands
+ 2.3.4 United Kingdom
# 2.3.4.1 England
# 2.3.4.2 Northern Ireland
# 2.3.4.3 Scotland
# 2.3.4.4 Wales
o 2.4 Oceania
+ 2.4.1 Australia
+ 2.4.2 New Zealand

Talk to the folks in countries that have universal health care. It fails miserably. I have traveled to England and Sweden in the past few years and specifically have asked some of the people how they like their evil universal heathcare. And guess what...... No complaints except one Swedish chic who wanted breast implants but the government wouldnt pay for it.... The problem with our heathcare is its a for profit institution and it shouldnt be. The drug companys and insurance companys must show profit. Everyone should be eligable for heathcare(including breast implants ). Not just the guy that can afford it. Our heathcare system is a joke. And it isnt the best in the world. Should police protection only be covered if you have insurance? Most of the people that dont support heathcare reform either have an agenda or are just plain naive and believe the big company propaganda.

This topic was split off from Can Obama Pull it Off.

Good move Kootch!

I am Canadian. 1/2 my family are USA. My father-in-law just died. Good insurance, fairly weathy folk. His care, in Hawaii, was definatly sub standard. Not the quality, the quantity.

No I would'nt trade health care systems EVER. Any "bought" politician who tries to get rid of our universal health care would never survive the next election. The insurance company's would try to tell you how bad it is, but like the guy said, who has ever went back to pay or die system.

Robby

I have friends in Europe and Canada and they don't like it. Long waits to see a doc, longer to see a specialist, docs with poor skills, little experience, specialists who are over worked and under paid, everyone is under pressure to deliver with long lines of folks waiting to get in.

I don't live there, but they all say about the same thing.

hugg wrote:Talk to the folks in countries that have universal health care. It fails miserably. I have traveled to England and Sweden in the past few years and specifically have asked some of the people how they like their evil universal heathcare. And guess what...... No complaints except one Swedish chic who wanted breast implants but the government wouldnt pay for it.... The problem with our heathcare is its a for profit institution and it shouldnt be. The drug companys and insurance companys must show profit. Everyone should be eligable for heathcare(including breast implants ). Not just the guy that can afford it. Our heathcare system is a joke. And it isnt the best in the world. Should police protection only be covered if you have insurance? Most of the people that dont support heathcare reform either have an agenda or are just plain naive and believe the big company propaganda.

Devil505 wrote:Good move Kootch!

Is there a a$$ ki$$ emoticon?

av8r wrote:

Devil505 wrote:Good move Kootch!

Is there a a$$ ki$$ emoticon?

Yea....That's me......the ass kisser from way back!! just ask Richard or Greg how good I am at it!

av8r wrote:I have friends in Europe and Canada and they don't like it. Long waits to see a doc, longer to see a specialist, docs with poor skills, little experience, specialists who are over worked and under paid, everyone is under pressure to deliver with long lines of folks waiting to get in.

I don't live there, but they all say about the same thing.

Don't ya just love this kind of post? Unnamed countries, vague criticisms, no specifics, no names of people, but unanimous dislike of the systems.

Name us a single country where all that unanimous disdain has resulted in even so much as a serious legislative effort to repeal universal healthcare. Even if it didn't succeed.

Because, so far, you're

There was a show on PBS about this and they examined a few sytems worldwide, three recurring themes kept cropping up.

• The systems were bankrupt in many of these countries.
• The other was that the doctors were not too happy and/or paid very well. Competition is always good and I would not want a sytem where doctors would be forced to accept some lowly wage. Just like any other profession the money is part of it and many of the brightest people might decide to go into another field if they knew they couldn't make decent money. Same thing with the hospitals.
• Some countries had issues with providing service promptly, e.g long waiting times to see a doctor.

Having said that from my understanding the paperwork involved with the healthcare in this country consumes 25% of the costs which is ridiculous. The one thing the countries they profiled on that show did well was eliminate all the paperwork but I have no confidence the government will be able to accomplish that here.

I think if you want to begin heatlthcare reform in this country they need to reform the insurance practices. For starters they should have to eliminate closed plans and make them available to anyone. Not to say they couldn't have different plans but tevery insurance company should have to offer a basic plan with minimum coverage and be required to offer it to anyone for the same costs. The same would be the case for any other plans they offer. This would still allow for a somewhat competitive market but encourage people to get health insurance injecting money into the system.

It's obvious the Social Security Ponzi Scheme isn't big enough, we should start up another one and call it Free Health Care.