mikeandgerry wrote:Ultimately, the umpires are us, not the government.
Unless you believe that, every so often (at election time) a group of Space Aliens descends & takes over our government, WE are the government & therefore WE are the umpires, right?
If any election in history proved that We The People can demand change from our government, this last one did.
mikeandgerry wrote:Then I guess you are saying the founding fathers were naive. Equal opportunity was their framework, not equal outcomes.
Not at all naive. They set up a strict series of Checks & Balances to avoid the very excesses of their homeland, England. The last administration did grave damage in preventing these Check & Balances from being allowed to do their Constitutional job.
mikeandgerry wrote:As for your ideas on economics....well, you don't have a clue as to the root cause of our economic woes. The Constitution was violated. The banks were compliant with the laws. It was the laws that weren't compliant with free market economics. The government overstepped its bounds in money and market creation.
Just because YOU believe that to be "The Root Cause" of our economic woes Mike, does not make it so. I believe the root cause was deliberate lack of intelligent government oversight, energy price fixing (which left little money for us to buy/pay for anything else) & downright criminal activity.
Time alone will prove one of us right.
Devil, I actually think we are agreeing on the "umpire" analogy but you are hellbent on arguing.
As for economics, there is no doubt that liberals are "challenged" in their understanding of it as it pertains to the constitution and our republic. You think free markets are unregulated and anarchic. They are not. The Constitution provides the rules and the umpires but the economic outcomes cannot be guaranteed. That is your mistake. There are risks in economies that are real and must be realized from time to time.
I hold all politicians accountable for the current crisis, but the problem is one of pushing markets where they won't go, manipulating markets for political gain, and failing to stop private manipulation. In other words, an abundance of counter-productive rules (some that violate the spirit of the Constitution) and a lack of ethical umpires.
I believe the root cause was deliberate lack of intelligent government oversight, energy price fixing (which left little money for us to buy/pay for anything else) & downright criminal activity.
I too believe that the government dropped the ball on derivatives oversight, accounting methods oversight, and banking oversight. Both the dems and the pubs screwed up
but their screw ups were in support of false economic beliefs that were politically motivated, i.e. that a consumption economy built on deficit spending is beneficial to the people. It is certainly not
beneficial in the long run.
Specifically and recently, the errors of congress were the repeal of the Glass-Steagall act, the adoption of the Community Reinvestment Act and the Sarbanes-Oxley Act. The repeal of Glass-Steagall eliminated the distinctions between financial entities that lead to increased systemic risks through derivative use that were difficult to oversee. The CRA lead to the encouragement of loose lending and loose money creation resulting in a speculative housing bubble and consumption bubble that was destine to crash. The Sarbanes-Oxley Act lead to certain draconian accounting requirements that forced financial institutions of all types to use mark-to-market accounting rules on their financial statements which contributed to the mortgage bubble by pushing securitizations and derivatives to be placed in SPE's (off-books holding companies). That caused ineffective free market evaluation of the underlying company.
Remember devil, the more rules you make, the more you have to comply with. Since ignorance is no excuse for breaking the law; The more expansive the law gets, the more we all become criminals.
There was a time when we needed only one rule. Now we have 1100 page monstrocities that are voted on without the legislators having time to read it.