Carbon Monoxide Problem

 
billyackiel
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Location: white haven, pa
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: alaska channing 3
Coal Size/Type: rice

Post by billyackiel » Wed. Oct. 22, 2014 9:00 am

hey guys just installed a Alaska channing 3 with the bottom rear vent, after about 3 hrs my carbon monoxide alarm goes off, thought my chimney pipe insert was to low so added another foot to raise it above the actual chimney and seal around it better incase it was leaking around the pipe, not sure if that can happen, also replaced lower door seal, going to replace upper door seal today, any other ideas? do I need a barometric damper?


 
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michaelanthony
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Post by michaelanthony » Wed. Oct. 22, 2014 9:12 am

I'm no stoker guy but I have read enough to ask: do you have a manometer to measure draft in flue pipe,and over fire? How is the gasket on your hopper? Alaska web site say's you need a barometric damper on powervent and chimney models. Is the grate seated properly? Can you post pic's of the install?
Thank you for having a C.O. detector!
Mike.

 
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blrman07
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Post by blrman07 » Wed. Oct. 22, 2014 9:15 am

Welcome to the forum. It's good to "see" you and now we can digest your question. You said you got an alarm after three hours of burning. You also asked if you need a barometric damper. Your symptom just based on the alarm after three hours indicates that you do not have enough draft for some reason. It could be that it's being robbed by air inflitration around your stovepipe in the chimney or bad gaskets on the doors. However my experience has been that if you have a good enough draft you can usually run a stoker without door gaskets! But then again I have been blessed with good drafting chimneys.

How new is your home? Is it "tight" with very little air infiltration? Try cracking a window near the stove and see if that helps. If it does your home is too tight.

Regarding a baro.....A baro helps to limit excessive draft which I surmise is not your problem. Your problem is not enough draft to take out the combustion air and the products of combustion in your firebox. I am sure more will chime in here shortly.

 
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McGiever
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Post by McGiever » Wed. Oct. 22, 2014 9:42 am

My suspect is too much combustion air from fan is creating a slight positive "over fire" pressure...manometer will show the facts.

New gaskets will likley make doors not leak...but remember this, the stove wants to operate w/ negative pressure inside, not positive.

But w/o manometer available now one could just try reducing the amount of combustion air being input and see if CO leaking issue goes away.(due to changing to negative in stove)

And order that manometer to take out the guess work. :idea:
Last edited by McGiever on Wed. Oct. 22, 2014 9:45 am, edited 1 time in total.

 
titleist1
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Post by titleist1 » Wed. Oct. 22, 2014 9:44 am

Welcome to the forum!! Great job having the CO monitor in place!! :up:

As already suggested the stoker is a balance between the combustion air forced into the firebox versus what the chimney can exhaust out. If you are pushing in too much air, it will look for other ways out than the chimney, such as the hopper or poor gaskets. A manometer is a great tool for this type situation.

In addition to the steps you already took on the flue pipe, check all stoker gaskets to make sure they are sealing properly. If you have a lid on the hopper check for moisture on the inside of it, that is an indicator of exhaust heading that direction. Not familiar with the combustion fan set up on the Channing but is there a way to throttle the amount of air back any?

Other Channing users will be here shortly to help out I am sure.

....typed too slow.....McG beat me to it...

 
billyackiel
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Location: white haven, pa
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: alaska channing 3
Coal Size/Type: rice

Post by billyackiel » Wed. Oct. 22, 2014 10:07 am

no I don't have a manometer, only control I have is the fans witch push the heat out and the coal feed, the combustion fan just runs at one speed also there is no moisture on the hopper lid. thanks for your help everyone. also I ran it with the window and door open because it was to hot for me so don't think its that
Last edited by billyackiel on Wed. Oct. 22, 2014 10:40 am, edited 1 time in total.

 
WNYRob
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Post by WNYRob » Wed. Oct. 22, 2014 10:37 am

Is there an adjustable cover over the combustion fan intake? if not, try putting some tape over it to limit the amount of air being blown into the fire.


 
billyackiel
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Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: alaska channing 3
Coal Size/Type: rice

Post by billyackiel » Wed. Oct. 22, 2014 10:44 am

theirs two plates for the combustion fan shaped like this [ ] , they slide together with a hole in the bottom of one for air to go in and the motor on the top with fan in between the end is open witch I assume also sucks air in

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Richard S.
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Post by Richard S. » Wed. Oct. 22, 2014 11:21 am

Get a CO detector with a ppm readout so you know exactly what is going on. It's nothing to mess with because high enough levels can mean instant incapacitation. It's also important to understand how CO alarms work. They have thresholds and will go off if it exceeds Xppm, Xppm for 1 hour, Xppm for 24hours, Xppm for a week, Xppm for a month. The longer increments have lower levels.

It could be going off because you exceeded the maximum threshold or the one hour threshold. You'll have to check the specs on yours to see what those thresholds are.

 
WNYRob
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Post by WNYRob » Wed. Oct. 22, 2014 12:08 pm

If this is the combustion blower you have, if you look at the left side of the fan in the picture you will see the grid that covers the intake. On Kokers, there is a plate that covers this area and is adjustable to decrease/increase the air being drawn into the fan. If you have a similar type fan, this input can be partially covered with anything. By limiting the amount of air being drawn in and ultimately blown into the stove, you are decreasing the pressure inside the stove so that your draft can evacuate all the combustion products.
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McGiever
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Post by McGiever » Wed. Oct. 22, 2014 7:55 pm

Notice the pivot blocking plate...this one is open very wide, usually half way blocked is more typical, but a Manometer can help to get it perfect. ;)
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billyackiel
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Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: alaska channing 3
Coal Size/Type: rice

Post by billyackiel » Thu. Oct. 23, 2014 5:27 am

Well I tore the whole stove apart to inspect and clean it, hopper gasket was rigged up from junk random pieces and not even sitting right, feeder assembly gasket was bad, also the gasket for under the grate was missing and I got a stove guy to take a look and I had the stove pipe coming out at a L shape and he suggested I put in two 45s and the baro. Hell be back sat morning to set the draft. I'll let u know how it goes.

 
titleist1
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Post by titleist1 » Thu. Oct. 23, 2014 7:00 am

Excellent work! Its good to go through a used stove for this type of maintenance when you first get it. You don't know how well it was serviced before so it gives you a good baseline to know things are 'right'.

You probably fixed the source of the leak by replacing those gaskets now its just a matter of balancing the combustion air with the exhaust and the manometer use will allow you to do that. I would suggest getting one and leaving it connected all the time as it can give you a heads up on any draft issues before CO starts leaking into the house. A Dwyer Magnehelic or a fluid Dwyer Model 25 are popular here.

 
billyackiel
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Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: alaska channing 3
Coal Size/Type: rice

Post by billyackiel » Thu. Oct. 23, 2014 8:24 am

for reference this is the back of the stove, combustion motor and fan in the middle and convection fans on both sides.

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tjnamtiw
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Post by tjnamtiw » Thu. Oct. 23, 2014 9:15 am

One also has to ask the obvious > how old is the CO detector and have you replaced its battery?


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