First Time in 4 Years, Running on Backup System

CoalHeat · Post by **CoalHeat** » Wed. Jan. 21, 2015 10:43 pm

Oh no!!!!!!

Sting · Post by **Sting** » Thu. Jan. 22, 2015 7:42 am

Another fine example how life can be so much easier when you have a backup plan.
Sorry you needed it - glad you have it
Best wishes that the coal appliance will get well soon

Kind Regards
Sting

Post by **StokerDon** » Thu. Jan. 22, 2015 7:40 pm

Sorry to hear the Harman is ill Coalkirk. If you use oil as a backup, now is the time to fill the tank. Who knows when oil will be this cheap again?

-Don

coalkirk · Post by **coalkirk** » Fri. Jan. 23, 2015 5:31 pm

Sting wrote:Another fine example how life can be so much easier when you have a backup plan.
Sorry you needed it - glad you have it
Best wishes that the coal appliance will get well soon

Kind Regards
Sting

Thanks. Yes it was pretty seamless. Flip a couple of switches and bing, bam, boom, back on oil. So got off a little earlier than projected today and had a chance to look under the hood to see what the heck happened. It looks to me like it was starving for air due to too many fines and very small pieces of coal on the grate. The cause of this was my auger. Coal bin is low and the auger screw was exposed. My bin is flat on the bottom, no sloped walls to the auger screw. So when it gets this low I have to shovel coal onto the screw. It sucks at that point. I might have let the auger run too long just barely pulling coal into the screw and it chopped it up a bit. So operator error. As you may have read in another thread, I'm planning on removing the auger for next season and going with a vacuum system. If that works well enough, I'll sell or repurpose the auger. Back online now with coal.

CoalisCoolxWarm · Post by **CoalisCoolxWarm** » Fri. Jan. 23, 2015 5:47 pm

StokerDon wrote:Sorry to hear the Harman is ill Coalkirk. If you use oil as a backup, now is the time to fill the tank. Who knows when oil will be this cheap again?

-Don

FYI. Filled offroad diesel tanks today. $1.989/gal

I run that in oil boiler, too. It's part of my emergency plan. Fuel inside and outside. Equipment and heat can all use same stuff, so better to keep the 600, 275, and at least a 55 gal barrel or two full.

Glad to hear you're back on the coal!

I was half considering letting the oil boiler do some running to keep out the cobwebs, with the low price of fuel.

Post by **StokerDon** » Sat. Jan. 24, 2015 10:20 am

CoalisCoolxWarm wrote:
StokerDon wrote:Sorry to hear the Harman is ill Coalkirk. If you use oil as a backup, now is the time to fill the tank. Who knows when oil will be this cheap again?

-Don
FYI. Filled offroad diesel tanks today. $1.989/gal

I run that in oil boiler, too. It's part of my emergency plan. Fuel inside and outside. Equipment and heat can all use same stuff, so better to keep the 600, 275, and at least a 55 gal barrel or two full.

Glad to hear you're back on the coal!

I was half considering letting the oil boiler do some running to keep out the cobwebs, with the low price of fuel.

I would like to get my oil burner back in operation as a backup too. Somehow, I just don't have the motivation to work on the oil burner.

-Don

CoalHeat · Post by **CoalHeat** » Thu. Jan. 29, 2015 9:36 pm

StokerDon wrote: I would like to get my oil burner back in operation as a backup too. Somehow, I just don't have the motivation to work on the oil burner.

-Don

Ha! I hear that!!

I just need to connect the oil furnace to the chimney and flip a switch or two and off it goes...until the oil runs out which could be almost immediately.

SMITTY · Post by **SMITTY** » Fri. Jan. 30, 2015 12:07 am

All I have to do is re-install the galvy tee (after hopefully remembering to remove the newspaper and bricks from the top of the flue ...

), hook up a wire in the aquastat, push the red button, flip the switch, and off she goes ... hopefully. Last time my oil burner sat idle, the electric eye failed upon startup. It's been idle now for 15 months, so who knows what kinds of surprises will be in store.

Could be mice living in there. Maybe my frog died in there! Haven't seen him since May of last year ...

freetown fred · Post by **freetown fred** » Fri. Jan. 30, 2015 6:56 am

---ya killed froggy????????????????? that ain't right--ya need to pen them thar killer cats up!!!!!!!!!!

PS--remove newspaper & brick! Just a lil reminder:)

Sunny Boy · Post by **Sunny Boy** » Fri. Jan. 30, 2015 7:12 am

waldo lemieux wrote:Rob ,

you already found the root cause, its not Honeywell.. seriously though, why did you or anybody else use a hydrolevel? Are they cheaper or ?? Ive never seen one and have no experience or reason to question their reliability just curious I guess. Too, do you always use a low water cutoff? I know steam systems have them ,but Ive never found one on a hot water system. Again , I am just curious ...

waldo

A low water cutoff is recommended for any hydronic system that is not hooked up to a water supply. When I built the radiant floor heat system in my shop, the building is not plumbed into a water supply. I fill the system by garden hose from the house. The low water cutoff has saved the boiler a couple of times when the system had a leak.

Paul

SMITTY · Post by **SMITTY** » Fri. Jan. 30, 2015 11:04 am

freetown fred wrote: ---ya killed froggy????????????????? that ain't right--ya need to pen them thar killer cats up!!!!!!!!!! PS--remove newspaper & brick! Just a lil reminder:)

No wasn't me or the cats - he hibernated later than usual last spring. He usually comes out a couple weeks after the start of the heating season .... but this year he's nowhere to be found.

RIP froggie ....

Rick 386 · Post by **Rick 386** » Fri. Jan. 30, 2015 6:16 pm

Oh no............................................................

You mean the frog croaked ???????????????????????

Sorry I had to say it before HB saw this !!!!

Rick

Post by **Rob R.** » Thu. Sep. 10, 2015 7:19 pm

A few updates. I decided to switch the "electro-well" for a standard aquastat well. I will lose the low water cutoff functionality, but at least the system won't falsely sense a low water condition. I may install a different type of low water cutoff in a different port, but that will come later. In the meantime the system is leak free and connected to a water supply at all times.

I also did a small wiring project to make the system more user friendly. Basically I hooked the end switch from the zone relays to a dpdt switch, which is connected to the TT terminals in each boiler aquastat. The Efm maintains 160 degrees and gravity circulates through the oil boiler, so I just have that set at 140. If the Efm goes down, the oil boiler will come on. If I want the oil boiler to run at "full power" and reach the high limit on a heat call, I just flip the switch.

Post by **Rob R.** » Thu. Sep. 10, 2015 7:45 pm

oilman wrote:Rob, I would suggest a good boiler treatment . There are many out there. In reality, all steel boilers should have treatment. In the 80's I was a Van Wert dealer. All new Van Wert boilers came with boiler treatment and they wanted you to add it yearly. This is where I got into the habit. When Van Wert went under I switched to Yellow Flame, and they also came with boiler treatment.
This is a fairly common thing with all the LWCO's ,whatever brand. The Beckett Aqusmart is having far more issues than the Hydrolevel. Their 2n1 sensor is having problems, but I'm sure they will figure it out.
I use mainly Sid Harvey's crystal cleer , Rhomar or Fernox treatments. Fernox also has a great magnetic filter you put into the boiler piping. If you are using any sort of ecm pump such as the Alpha, Bumblebee or Wilo you really should run one.
Also, Sleeper is right on with his comments. A system that is pumping away, with the pressure reducing valve connected at the point of no pressure change and most importantly, a good microbubbler air eliminator such as a Spirovent will be much cleaner due to no oxygen coming into the system.And, what does get in will be scrubbed out.

I picked up 2 quarts of boiler treatment today and will add it to the system when I remove the aquastat well. Thanks again for the advice.

CoalisCoolxWarm · Post by **CoalisCoolxWarm** » Wed. Sep. 16, 2015 2:49 pm

Rob R. wrote:I also did a small wiring project to make the system more user friendly. Basically I hooked the end switch from the zone relays to a dpdt switch, which is connected to the TT terminals in each boiler aquastat. The Efm maintains 160 degrees and gravity circulates through the oil boiler, so I just have that set at 140. If the Efm goes down, the oil boiler will come on. If I want the oil boiler to run at "full power" and reach the high limit on a heat call, I just flip the switch.

I've been working out a setup for this, got some of the parts and in your situation, what happens for initial startups when the boiler needs time to light and bring everything up to temp? Does it automatically run the oil boiler? What if you're not in a hurry and just want to let the coal do its thing until warm?

Or- is this only for "standby/backup" operation?

These are some of the questions I had to address.

First Time in 4 Years, Running on Backup System

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